Are You Willing to

Be Uncomfortable?

Ep. 73 ft. Jason Frazell

“We always have the opportunity to be leaders.”

Jason Frazell

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Jason is a Growth and Leadership Coach for high-impact people and teams in tech. He is also the host of the podcast Talking to Cool People, a speaker and is a leader at a coach training program.

Show Notes

What does it look like to follow the thing that keeps you up at night? From choosing to go with your passion to getting comfortable with uncomfortably, Jason Frazell brings practical steps to creating your ideal life schedule.

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In this episode you will learn about:

  • Attracting the people you’re meant to work with
  • What does the noes mean about you and for you?
  • The pace of starting something new
  • Getting comfortable with uncomfortability
  • Scheduling your ideal day




Lesley Logan 0:00
Hey, BE IT listener, what’s up? I have an awesome guest for you, Jason Frazell. Ah, so fun. Um, we probably should have recorded everything before I hit record. And then after, it might out of context mean nothing to most listeners, but it was super fun. And I’m really excited to have … his words in your ears because he is someone who was in a regular, real job, real, (like all jobs are real, that’s lame) but really, like, you know, the ones with the 401k, and the health insurance and the paid vacations and all the things and he was slaying, you know, he was doing so great. And he changed that. And he’s now working for himself. And it’s can be scary. And, you know, like many of us who had maybe started something new. And then the pandemic happen, you know, Brad and I, Brad came working for me full time, three months before, (Lesley laughs) for me with me for three months before the pandemic happened. And, you know, it can be really scary when you have made a leap. And then something happens that makes you question whether or not that leap was a good idea or not. And so, what I love is, he made that leap, he’s dove straight in, he’s really rocking it. And he’s an expert in a lot of things. And he’s got a really cool podcast, and I was on it. So y’all gotta go, listen, we’ll have that link in the show notes below. But um, what I hope you hear from this podcast is that, you know, having people around you that support you, inspire you is important. Especially when you’re wondering if you should do the thing and also that like, whatever it is that you’re doing working for someone, working for yourself. There’s there’s a lot of pressures and a lot of scary stuff. But, you know, if it’s the thing that you have on your heart to do, you got to do it, you got to find a way to do it. So here is Jason Frazell.

Lesley Logan 3:29
Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I’m Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and business fitness coach. I’ve trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it’s the antidote to fear. Each week, my guests will bring Bold, Executable, Intrinsic and Targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It’s a practice, not a perfect. Let’s get started.


Lesley Logan 2:30
All right, everyone. Hello, welcome back to Be It Till You See It. I am so excited. I have a conversation for you. I have this amazing guests name is Jason Frazell. I hope I didn’t screw that up because … (Jason: You got that Lesley) asked (Lesley laughs) (Jason: You’re good) this it’s so funny is, um, we we randomly connected inside of a group that we’re both in. And then because the world is so small, and I was like, “Who knows who’s ever interviewed a Pilates person?” You’re like, “Oh, do you happen to know this guy, Benjamin?” I’m like, “Oh, yeah.” (Lesley laughs) Benjamin, I go way back, like years back. So it’s just (Jason: Yeah) funny that we have mutual friends in (Jason: We do) common. And we didn’t even know each other until the interwebs brought us together. So Jason, can you tell everyone, who’s listening, who you are and what you’re excited about right now?

Jason Frazell 3:13
Yeah, Lesley. I am, so like you said I’m Jason Frazell. Congratulations on getting my last name correct in the first try. (Lesley: Yeah) So yea it puts you in the top like third of all people. There you go. (Lesley: Well, we like to be unique) I am … Yeah, so I always like to start with. So I’m a dad. I’ve got two kids, married, from Minnesota live in New York now, moved out 15 years ago. So, I’m a, I call myself East Coaster with a Midwestern attitude sometimes. (Lesley laughs) So that’s like … (Lesley: Sometimes) sometimes

Lesley Logan 3:41
… 15 years. I mean, yeah, that’s a sometimes (Jason: Yeah) at that point.

Jason Frazell 3:44
I can, I can also cut people New York style. (Jason Yeah) So what I do for work, which is what I think you’re asking is I’m a growth and leadership coach. And I specifically focus on people and teams and tech. So, I work with founders, co founders, individual contributors, directors all the way up, both in startups and in big tech. So, I have customers that work at places like Facebook and Google, and I also coach with a lot of startups. In addition to that I’m a fellow podcaster. (Lesley: Yeah) And I won’t spoil the surprise, we won’t … spills surprise, Lesley is gonna be a guest on my show soon, (Lesley: Yeah) very soon. I have a show called “Talking to Cool People.” It’s a fun podcast similar to this where we’ll talk about some cool stuff. And then I’m also a personal brand strategist at a company called Brand Builders Group, which I know you’re familiar with. (Lesley: Yeah. I love …) They know a little bit about me.

Lesley Logan 4:29
I love Brand Builders. They’ve been so good to me. And also, we’ve had many Brand Builders on the show. So it’s really … (Jason: Nice.) Yeah, it’s really great. Jason, I want to talk about being a leadership coach, though, because I think it’s really interesting, because I actually, I think so few people realize how much of a leader they are on this on this planet, right? Like, (Jason: Yeah) like every single one of us has it’s opportunity to lead people and we … (Jason: Everyone) We think it’s like, “Oh, maybe, maybe I maybe only teach five people” or maybe only maybe, maybe you don’t actually run a company, but we actually all have an opportunity to be a leader to somebody. So, how do you, how do you, first how do you become a leadership coach? And then second, what are you seeing happening as far as people? What’s getting in the way of people seeing that in themselves?

Jason Frazell 5:14
Yeah. I’m going to answer your the first part of your question with two answers. How do you become a leadership coach? You don’t have to do anything. You call yourself a leadership coach. (Lesley laughs) It’s not like it’s so it’s not like being a Pilates. I mean, I guess you could call yourself a Pilates instructor …

Lesley Logan 5:31
Yeah, we’re supposed to go to the training. (Lesley laughs)

Jason Frazell 5:33
Right? But so you can call yourself that. But then people go, “Wait a second, how are you trained?” So anybody can call someone as a leadership coach, life coach and executive coach. So that’s what makes the coaching industry a little bit different is there’s no regulation. (Lesley: Right) So you see people call themselves, else, there’s probably my guess is there’s probably Pilates coaches who don’t have training would be my guess. Or (Lesley: Yeah) if they have, they don’t have the level of training that you do. That’s, so to answer the first part of your question, how I became a leadership coach is I actually, almost four years ago, was in the middle of my my corporate career, and I just like something wasn’t working for me. And I wasn’t really sure what it was. I ended up hiring somebody worked with her for eight months. Through that work, I decided that I was going to go through the same coach training program that she went through, ended up doing a year long coach training program, put in hundreds of hours, from there have coached over a thousand hours of people and I’m now a leader at that coach training program. So that, so how I call myself a leadership coach, is how you call yourself a Pilates coaches through training, and time in the field and the good, bad and the ugly that all that comes with.

Lesley Logan 6:36
That is insane. That is (Jason: Yeah) that’s a lot. So but I, but I also love that (Jason: A lot) because I think sometimes you, what it sounds like is you set out to work in corporate and have this job. And then you’re like, “I have a problem. I’m gonna hire someone.” And then you’re like, “Wow, this is really cool. I want to help other people.” (Jason: Yeah) I actually think that’s how most people end up where they’re gonna be and (Jason: Totally) and they put this pressure on themselves that they’re supposed to know what they want to be when they grow up. But they might not have had the experience to know what that is yet.

Jason Frazell 7:04
No. I’m, I’m so with you. So, if you talk a lot of coaches that I know that do more personal coaching, most of them hired a coach, and they’re like, “Oh, this work is really fulfilling. Oh, this is something I want to do.” So, I agree with you on all that. And yeah, I agree. Like, I think that’s like for those and I came from corporate I worked almost 20 years in corporate for me as like, “Hey, something’s missing. I’ve got this problem.” I’m not sure what the problem is, which is interesting way to buy something when you’re like, “I don’t know what the problem is.” But I’m (Lesley: Right) gonna spend money on it anyway, and then quickly discovered what it was I just didn’t like, what I was bored. I mean, that’s what it came down that I was bored. And I had the entrepreneurial fire. And I didn’t, but I was too comfortable. So, I didn’t know it. And so (Lesley: Yeah. There …) yada, yada, yada, as they say on Seinfeld here we are on the podcast. (Jason and Lesley laughs)

Lesley Logan 7:10
But it’s all I’ve had, I have friends who, who lost their jobs. And they, I was like, “I’m so sorry.” They’re like, “Honestly, the best thing ever happened,” because it was like, it was too comfortable. But also couldn’t leave it because like, you know, it’s hard, it’s hard to leave the paycheck and the guaranteed and all the benefits and all the things. So you’re you’ve been thousands of hours later. So my other question is, like, what keeps people from thinking that they’re a (Jason: Yeah) leader?

Jason Frazell 8:17
Yeah. So for some people, and I think this really relates to … I don’t want to stereotype. But you see this, this is obviously gonna make sense for people that are a little bit newer into their career, newer into their, into their personal journey, is the idea that you have to have somebody reporting to you. We have to have some sort of actual authority over somebody. I don’t agree with that. I think to your point, we always have to, we always have the opportunity to be leaders. So for example, you and I are going to have people listen to us on this podcast, and they’re going to go, they may like me, they may hate me, but they’re probably going to listen to what I have to say. It’s same for you, they probably, probably love you, which is why they’re tuning in. (Lesley laughs)

Lesley Logan 8:56
A laugh is helpful, actually. (Jason and Lesley laughs) I think some of them listen for that. (Lesley laughs)

Jason Frazell 9:00
Yea I bet they like the laugh. They like Lesley’s laugh and amongst other things. But um, so I think the disconnect for people is understanding that we actually know a lot more than we think we do, especially when we’re starting out, especially in fields where it’s not purely about expertise. Like things like sales, things like marketing, where a lot of that is very artful. And you bring it and you bring a different perspective, like, obviously, there are certain fields that are quite into the note like … you know, like engineering, manufacturing, where you really need to know the specifics. I think like fitness, (Lesley: Yeah) you really need to know a lot of the science behind that to do a good job with it. But (Lesley: Yeah) understanding that what you bring is a unique flavor. And that as you build that people look to you as a leader, whether or not you’re managing them. I think that’s (Lesley: Yeah) that’s one of the first disconnects. The second disconnect that I see is people that have a job they don’t like and they don’t acknowledge that all the other roles they play in their life has them be a leader, whether they’re a parent, their date, you know their spouse or they’re in a romantic relationship, that friends are involved in their church, they’re involved in charities. All those places we get to show up as leaders and a lot of people like, “Well, I’m not a leader because I don’t manage anybody at work.” (Lesley: Right) And I would say, do you, you know, do you, “Do you help your kids with their homework?” That’s leadership, I mean, it’s parenting, but it’s also leadership and how do you show up there. So. I’m with you, everybody is a leader in their own way. And we all (Lesley: Yeah) played it in many, many different roles.

Lesley Logan 10:18
Yeah, yeah. I love that. I am … So, I want to go into you recently got into your coaching business. So you were in corporate for 20 years? How recently, (Jason: Yeah) I mean, like, a thousands of hours (Jason: Three years) of coaching? Three years? Okay

Jason Frazell 10:31
Yeah. Three years. Yeah. (Lesley: Yeah. So …) It feels like a long time.

Lesley Logan 10:35
Especially with a COVID year … (Lesley laughs)

Jason Frazell 10:37
I know, the COVID year, yeah, exactly.

Lesley Logan 10:38
Especially with COVID year. I’m always shocked when I realized …. we moved to Vegas, Las Vegas, from Los Angeles during the pandemic. And it surprises me how long I’ve lived here because it (Jason: Yeah) doesn’t it feels long. It also doesn’t feel that long. So it (Jason: Yeah) it’s like a it’s weird time work. But you guys, you’ve been doing this for a little over three years, thousands of hours. Similar to when we start this podcast, there was no episodes, no listeners. When you start a coaching business, it’s not like, it’s not like you open the doors and people are like, lined up already. So, how do you, how did you start that? Like, how did you go, how did like, because there’s a there is a Be It Till You See It in there. Like, you’re telling your people, (Jason: Yeah) “I’m a coach.” And yet you have no clients.

Jason Frazell 11:18
Yeah. I’m laughing about this for two reasons. One, because there’s a lot of people on LinkedIn, who will sell you that will try and sell you on, “oh, we’ll fill up your practice with these people.” Um, no.

Lesley Logan 11:30
Oh my God, they do that on LinkedIn, you know what I (Jason: Yeah) have it there’s like, on because I get the DMs on Instagram daily, daily (Jason: Say thing probably) right, like, (Jason: Yeah) “Here for $7, you can get 7000 followers. And also like, what, what’s your affiliate because I can bring you tons of customers.” It’s like, “Hmm.” (Jason: And you’re like, “Yeah.”) I don’t think you can. (Lesley laughs) So this happen (Jason: Yeah) on LinkedIn. Okay.

Jason Frazell 11:51
Yeah. So, um, the way that I started my business is, well, first of all, I just, I just started it, right. So I just said, “Okay,” and I was in my coach training program. So I had a grand total of maybe 30 hours of training, and decided that I was going to go out and find some clients. (Lesley: Yeah) So I went out and did that. And I did that through word of mouth and my network and said, “Hey, this is what I’m up to. Anybody interested in doing some pro bono stuff?” (Lesley: Yeah) Becuase when you start out, it’s it’s nice to you know, it’s nice to get out, get some referrals, some testimonials, and let people know that, “Hey, like, you know, I’m new to this.” And I wasn’t, I wasn’t trying to pretend somebody I wasn’t, (Lesley: Right) “I’m new to this. And I’d love to provide the service to you”. And through that work, just generated some generated some paying clients, which then generates more paying clients and on and on and on, and on, and on, we go. So for me, it was just a matter, it was kind of like a be it till you, you know, like, “Hey, like, this is what I’m going to do. And this is how we train new coaches in the coach training program. I’m a leader at.” Just go out and talk to people and start doing it. There’s all these and this kind of goes back to the LinkedIn or the Instagram thing, generate followers or LinkedIn, or all these tricks of getting people just like, just go talk to people share authentically on your Facebook page or on your LinkedIn or in your IG like, “This is what I’m up to. Do you know anybody?” (Lesley: Yeah) And eventually, somebody will you’ll start to attract the people that you’re meant to work with. And the rest is history.

Lesley Logan 13:12
Yeah. I mean, there’s very few businesses that cannot be built on referrals. And (Jason: Right) yes, I think like social media makes us all think that it’s a numbers, if it’s about how many followers we have. I know people who have 1000 followers who make hundreds of 1000s of dollars. (Lesley: Yeah) and I know people who have hundreds of 1000s of followers who make no money. So it’s not the followers. It’s like how like, it is that word of mouth. Did you help someone? Did you change their life in some way? And then asking them, “Who else do you know? (Jason: Yeah …) Who can use what I just gave you?” And it’s really, (Jason: Copy chapter …) it’s really crazy. So, I think it’s really cool. I love that you started out with like, “Hey, I’m working on this thing. Can I work with you?” And like, “Can you (Jason: Yeah) tell me …?” I think that it’s you know, that is also scary because so many people are afraid of rejection. (Lesley laughs)

Jason Frazell 13:58
Oh my God. Yeah. Well, and I and I came from, I spent almost 20 years in sales and corporate sales and technology and worked at some big companies worked at some startups. So I was used to getting “Noes” Right? But it’s different getting a “no” when you’re like, “I don’t want your piece of software,” And you’re like, “No, I don’t want to work with you on an individual level.” That’s a very different, “no.” And it took me a while to get used it and I still don’t, I still don’t, I don’t ever like being told “no” but that that’s a whole different conversation. But it’s I’d still don’t like it but it’s hard because you’re it’s just you like I was (Lesley: Right) it was just, it’s literally, it was just me and my business and the service that I provided with nothing else behind and people were like, “I don’t think so.” So, I’m like, “Oh, well what’s wrong with me?” Like that’s … what’s wrong with me (Lesley: Right) what I need to do differently? And, I don’t know …

Lesley Logan 14:44
So, what … (Jason: Yeah) what do you do differently? Like because it’s true like my my husband he does talks on like “200 noes.” Like that’s how you build your business like go for the noes because the (Jason: Yeah) more noes you get like the better you get at talking about what you do and all this stuff and and he … You know, he’s born salesperson. So, it’s really me … (Jason: I like him already.) I know “noes” do not like bother him that much. He’s just like … I mean, like, it’s kind of amazing. So it’s been helpful for me (Lesley laughs) as someone who, when people say “no,” it’s like, “Oh, it’s it feels like it’s a no to you when it’s (Jason: sure) not.” So how did you get over that? Or how do you teach people to like not take those noes when it’s their personal business? (Jason: Yeah) Your personal coaching? Like, how do you take that? What do you tell yourself?

Jason Frazell 15:26
Yeah, so this is an interesting question. I’m thinking about this, how I do it for myself. And then also, when I’m coaching other entrepreneurs who get a lot of noes is getting curious about what you make it mean about you? Like, what is that like, for you, when you’re first getting those noes. Like, what do you make it mean about you? Do you make it mean that there’s something that you’re not talented enough? Does it mean that there’s something about who you were? And then also, the idea like what your husband, it’s just a numbers game. And when you get out of the scarcity mindset, and into the abundance mindset, which these are overused, jargony stuff. But it’s true, like there’s more people that I’m the perfect coach for them can ever hire me, it’s like, there’s (Lesley: Right) more people that could … They just don’t know who I am. And that’s it. So (Lesley: Yeah) there’s a way to and there’s a, there’s a coach out there, she has something that I like to quote her name’s “Stacy Boehm.” And she’s a coach for, she’s this coach for selling life coaching. And her her target demographic is females. She has this one thing that she says it really stuck with me. She said, “What would you do if you knew your ideal clients were looking for you?” Like, what would you do today? What would you do tomorrow? Like, what’s the thing that you would do? Because like, what we all do is we’re like, “Oh, there’s nobody out there. Nobody’s interested.” But like, if I knew that you wanted to hire me, when you just didn’t know me, what would I actually do and what I post on social media. Would I pay for ads? Would I do search engine, would I go to a networking event, and like that’s the thing that I would say like, “Hey, what would you do?” Because the truth is, there are people out there for everybody. And I really do believe that.

Lesley Logan 16:56
That’s so good. I love that so much.

Jason Frazell 16:58
It’s Stacy’s, I wish, I wish I could take it. It’s Stacy. But …

Lesley Logan 17:01
I know. Well, Stacy, thanks so much. (Jason laughs) We’re all gonna live by that because, like, even inside like, I it’s almost like, I wish I had heard that, even though I believe that they’re like, you’re on the right … person for the right people. And that it’s okay, if you don’t like what I’m offering, because there are more people just even hearing that would change how I would like change them in the thoughts I have posting on when there’s a sale or when there’s a launch? (Jason: No) Because it’s, it’s like, what if people were looking there are actually Googling and you need to come up? And like, how would you do that? And you’d be less scared, “Oh, it’s like, that’s way better than leap and the net will appear.” (Jason and Lesley laughs) Right? That’s so good. (Jason: Yeah) Um, yeah, I do think like, fear rejection is real. And it keeps people (Jason: Sure) from doing. So, okay, you mentioned earlier and maybe this is too personal, you know, let me know, but like, you have two kids …

Jason Frazell 17:52
Nothing’s too personal. I’m here.

Lesley Logan 17:53
Yeah. You have two kids, you’re married, you know, like, and you wanted to switch careers? How hard like, what did you, how, what, what, why did you go? How could you do that? How did you do that? And also, like, was it scary because I do think, you know, when for people might not know, in 2019, Brad sold his companies and came full fully on board with my businesses, which is so exciting. And then three months later, we had COVID happen. And I was like, “Oh, well, okay, this is, this ship is only sailing with, with this is all I got. So here we go.” (Jason: Yeah) Like, what was it like for you with kids and spouse? Like, was it easy (Jason: Yeah) to make that transition or was it hard?

Jason Frazell 18:29
Well, I’m very fortunate that my wife is amazing. And so it could have been a lot harder if it wasn’t for the fact that I told her what I saw and what I believed was possible. And she was on board with me. My wife has more of a vision and goals and person than I am. I’m more of a pragmatic, practical as a good. This is one of the Midwestern comes and I’m like … “What’s practical about all this?” She’s more like, “Hey, well, what, what do you think would make you happy? What do you believe? What does your intuition tell you?” And, you know, I have been fortunate I had a good career before that. So it wasn’t like, I was living paycheck to paycheck at that point. So it was, you know, it was, it was a conscious family decision. (Lesley: Yeah) And but yeah, I’m fortunate to have an amazing partner that supported me in that because I was, you know, if the tables were turned, I don’t know that I would have had the same response be like, “Well, what do you mean? Go back, get another job. Making what you’re making. We got to keep this money flowing in.” So yeah, (Lesley: Yeah) but the truth is, it’s all it’s all about a powerful conversation, my wife and just getting aligned on what this is, what I’m going to do and why. And it also helped that when I decided to do this, I had already started the business. So it was a side hustle that went full time quite quickly. But I had a, I had a few proof points. It’s not like one day I’m like, “I’m out of here. I don’t know what I’m going to do.” (Lesley: Right) I was already, I was already turning out a couple clients and it certainly wasn’t enough to pay the bills. But I was I was on the path already. (Lesley: Yeah.) Which (Lesley: That’s …) that’s what, that’s one thing I would say to to everyone listening is, “You don’t have to just quit full boat and go full into it immediately.” A lot of people that I coached that like are that working like places like Facebook, and they want to do a side hustle, they do them both. (Lesley: Yeah) Then at some point, your business becomes big enough where you do need to go out and do it yourself. I do believe at some point, you have to work only in your business. But there’s no shame in like doing the side hustle stuff, you know, like, there seems to be this culture. Like, “if you’re really committed, you’ll just do it.” I’m like, that’s not realistic for a lot of people.

Lesley Logan 20:25
It’s, thank you for saying that. I think it’s 100% true. I mean, I, I, I think it’s easy for people looking outside, they might see that somebody went from Facebook to this company, and they’re like, “Whoa, how” but really, most people are, if they are transitioning from one thing to the other, there was a time where they’re doing two things. And like, that’s (Jason: Yeah) how, that’s how all of my businesses were. You know, I was, I was running studios, as I was renting space far enough away, that it was allowed, but also like building my own business. And (Jason: Yeah) then, and then I figured out how many clients I had to have to make the switch. And then we made that leap. And that was sitting down and like being really conscious about like, “How many pe… people is that so I could make that switch?” And it’s difficult, and we didn’t have kids. So it was a lot easier, I could overwork a little bit for a short period of time to make that happen. And then when I want to transition again, you know, we did the the bridge again, and the only (Jason: Yeah) time it was like, rip… let the boat you know, burn the boats or whatever was because of COVID. (Lesley and Jason laughs) It was like “Oh, (Jason: Yeah) well, we’re we’re gonna have to close that studio. And this and this, because it’s not reopening anytime soon.” (Lesley laughs)

Jason Frazell 21:38
No. State mandated

Lesley Logan 21:40
Yeah. (Jason: closing) Yeah, I know. I think it’s I mean, and if you’re listening to this I lived in California, so the gyms would didn’t open for 13 months. So it was (Jason: Right) you know I was just like, “This is not … I could see the writing on the wall. Like they’re, they’re not reopening me any anytime soon.” So, so I think thank you for sharing that because I do believe a lot of people think I have to have it all together. And I have to go all in. And it’s like, I just believe that there’s like … there’s a trial period as a trying something on, there’s like, figuring it out and like and then knowing that you have a little bit and then you have to get uncomfortable. So can we talk about that, like, there (Jason: Yeah) Is it still uncomfortable in your business? Or now your three and a half years in like it feels a little less uncomfortable? Like, what was that like going you know, that getting comfortable with uncomfortability?

Jason Frazell 22:23
Yeah, so it’s, it’s still uncomfortable because I’m still, my business is morphing is the word I’ll use, or it’s becoming more aligned to what I actually want to do all day, every day. It’s kind of like, I don’t know, it’s kind of even like my podcast. I’m at almost 100 episodes. It’s a little different than it was 100 episodes ago. That (Lesley: Yeah) so that is, to me, that’s a fun, uncomfortable. I actually I’m actually one of those people. I kind of like being uncomfortable. (Lesley: Yeah) So it’s fun to because for me uncomfortable means that I’m a little bit in the unknown, which means there’s something super creative and innovative, which is like where I do my best work. (Lesley: Yeah) But yeah, after spending 20 years with a paycheck every two weeks, and a bunch of operational people and benefits and stock options and 401k’s and all that. And then to suddenly be like, “Oh, wait, if I want to make any money and be successful, it’s on me today.” Like, (Lesley: Yeah) that’s still uncomfortable. I’m still getting use to that I’m, we call that like, I call that a corporate context. I’m still breaking it up. (Lesley: Yeah) But there’s days where I’m like, “Man, I just wish I’d have somebody that would just tell me what to do today. Or like, send me 20 clients.” And I’m like, “No.” So the uncomfortable part is. And the exciting part is what’s next, who’s my next client? So for me, like, I don’t know who my next client might be. (Lesley: Right) I might get somebody to hit my website today, which might be the client that hires me at my highest rate, which refers me 10 clients, which creates the business of my dreams, or that might not happen for a year and that that’s the uncomfortable thing. Because my automatic place that I like to go is I like to know. How’s it gonna go because I was in sales. So your husband probably like sales is all about predictability. (Lesley: Right) Oh, like, “Hey, quarter after quarter, how am I gonna build this pipeline,” and I just don’t, it’s just not a thing in this in my business. So that part is uncomfortable for me.

Lesley Logan 24:12
Well, and also I’m reading Joe Dispenza’s book. (Who knows what it’s called, actually, I’m sorry, I’m obviously not reading it. It’s on Audible. So, I just hit play.) Anyways, it’s about getting out of your own way. Someone will tell (Jason: Yeah) me on Instagram and go, “Shame on you for not knowing he’s brilliant.” He is brilliant. It’s amazing. But he talks about like how we all want cause and effect. We’re all living … in this like Newtonian thing, which is like, (Jason: Oh, yeah) this happens and this happens. But when we start to actually understand that we are causing an effect that is like, it’s like you’re unstoppable. It’s this crazy thing. And and it’s true because I, because I was in corporate, I was in fitness corporate, which is nice. (Jason: Yeah) Like they put budgets out. (Jason: Yeah, like …) I meet them, you know, and like I lead a team and either way I had vacations and 401k’s and amazing health insurance that I don’t have any more, I have something (Lesley laughs) that they (Jason: Yeah) that they let self employed person by. But there that is all, that that is there is something like that, that and I, on a bad day I’ll go, “Gosh, you know, what am I doing?” And then I’ll go and then I can look back at like the promotions I didn’t take and I can look to the friends that are still there and I can go, “You know that I’m not that person.” And (Jason: Yeah) that’s I think, to to to go back would be denying that I’m like, I am someone who has to keep creating and I have to as much as I hated I I clearly love being in the unknown because I spent so much time there. (Lesley laughs)

Jason Frazell 25:40
Yeah. Well just … Yeah, I heard just a quick anecdote on this. I don’t know if you saw what happened to Peloton last week, but they (Lesley: Tell me) well, Peloton had was one of the best performing stocks in during you know, kind of the height of COVID. They released their quarterly earnings last week, they were not good. Their stock dropped 35%. And they went on a hiring freeze, I saw as of today. (Lesley: Wow) So, so like, and I say this to people that are in corporate that, that it’s it might be more secure, but it’s not that much more secure, you’re still at the whim and mercy of of you know, one bad quarter and they dropped 35% and all those, I’m assuming all those employees hold stock options. There goes 30, you know, 35% of your wealth and stock options down.

Lesley Logan 26:23
Well 100 … look that’s it, you’re either like you and I we work for ourselves. So like, I am at the mercy of making sure my messaging is good enough that people buy it. But those corporations are at the mercy of those investors and those stockholders (Jason: Yeah) and people. And so like, wherever, however you slice it, there are people you answer to and there is difficulties and there’s scary times but like I think, you know, if you were to look back, I don’t know I don’t answer for you. But I have I when I look back, I I would be struggling right now to work for someone doing something and not doing what I’m doing right now. Because what I’m doing right now is like literally what’s inside of me what like comes to my mind, what keeps me up at night. What me… and I can take action on that. I’m actually I feel like I’m fulfilling my purpose. And I think (Jason: Yeah) that that’s what it is. So I don’t know, I think it’s hard to be uncomfortable. But I don’t know that (Jason: Yeah) it was much more comfortable on the other side. It was just like there’s a paycheck. (Lesley laughs)

Jason Frazell 27:20
Yeah, yeah. Right. But I mean, you know, as a salesperson, I’m it sounds like all the things you’re doing. There’s a lot of uncomfortable meetings you go to ,where you tell your boss, “Oh, we’re breaking into this million dollar deal.” And then the customers like, “Yeah, we’re not doing it.” Then you have to have a … that’s not comfortable either.

Lesley Logan 27:35
Right, right. I think we’re just … Well, I think the grass looks greener on the other side. And we think that it’s all there. But the reality is, is that like, you know, putting one foot step in front of the other without knowing what it’s going to be is like the way you get anywhere, you know. So …

Jason Frazell 27:49
I’m with you and I, you and I are on the same page for sure, Lesley.

Lesley Logan 27:52
Alright, Jason, how do people get to know you? Get to work with you? Find out how to get leadership coaching with you because it sounds like you’re doing some really cool stuff with all (Jason: Yeah) these companies.

Jason Frazell 28:00
Yeah, thanks so much, Lesley. Yeah, best place to start is just my website. It’s just my name. So, it’s Jason Frazell f r a z e l And from there, you can also connect with me on Instagram, on Facebook, on LinkedIn. And I do want to put in a plug that I mentioned earlier, I’m a podcaster as well. And if anybody here is listening who is interested in coming on my podcast next year, it’s “Called Talking to Cool People”. And check it out. It was actually, it’s a, we’ll talk about on my podcast how the name came about it was pretty funny. And so you can connect with me there and listen to some of my episodes, I talk to all sorts of interesting people from let’s, very diverse set of individuals that I’ve talked to over the last couple years. So yeah, connect me on all the social. I’m the only person on social with my name, I believe (Lesley: That’s amazing) it’s a pretty unique name. It’s a pretty unique name. Yeah. And, and then my website and I look forward to hearing from you and connecting with you. And so you know, I can support everybody out there.

Lesley Logan 28:52
Yeah, well, our listeners will be very excited. Y’all, he does talk to cool people. He interviewed Benjamin Degenhardt. (Jason: I did) And our listeners are many of them are big fans of his. So, y’all can go.

Jason Frazell 29:03
I know Benjamin. So yes, that’s awesome. (Lesley: That’s so crazy) It such a small world.

Lesley Logan 29:08
It’s so small. He’s, he’s amazing. I, we used to pre COVID run into each other all over the world, because of pilates. (Jason: I can imagine) So like (Jason: I can imagine) would be at the same event and it’s like, I would never see him in our home cities, but we’d see each other and other people’s cities which are just so fun. Okay, so I asked everyone bold, executable, intrinsic, targeted steps to prioritizing yourself. How do you be it till you see it? What do you what tips do you got for us?

Jason Frazell 29:33
Yeah, be it till you see it. So first things first, this is very tactical, for those who are … And I think this applies to sales people working for others. This applies to entrepreneurs, put in your calendar, block out your calendar, like you had customers there, or you had clients there. So for new salespeople, I coach a lot of salespeople. When you start out there’s like, “Oh my gosh, there’s a lot of things to learn to do,” like block out your calendar like you had that appointments already, and then use that time to prospect, use that time to get, as your husband, Brad said, use that time to get some noes and hopefully some yeses. (Lesley: Yeah) If for an entrepreneur like you’re, I know like let’s say you’re a new personal trainer, and you’ve got three clients and you’ve got, you know, 20 hours of your week, not ready, book it up, and then figure out what you’re going to use that time for to either improve yourself, go find clients. So, I think there’s some energy that gets put out when you do that. There’s some things that like, that’s like a, I’m not gonna say manifesting, but you’re actually telling, actually telling the universe or spirit or God or whatever you believe, “Hey, there’s some stuff that I’m going to be doing here.” And it also trains you to get used to what that schedule is going to be like. So (Lesley: Yeah) for example, some coaches like, “I want 30 clients a week.” And I’m like, “Do you?” (Jason laughs)

Lesley Logan 30:42
I know, I get that a lot when we coach Pilates instructors and they’re like, “I think I want to teach 30 hours a week.” And I’m like, “You do? You wanna (Jason: You’re like …) teach 30 hours a week?”

Jason Frazell 30:49
… You’re like, “Have you ever taught 30 hours a week?” And they’re like, “Nope … I could tell.”

Lesley Logan 30:53
Yeah. (Jason: So …) Let me just tell you, you don’t, that’s a lot of human being.

Jason Frazell 30:56
It’s a lot of human beings that it’s like, you won’t get to eat probably. (Lesley: Yeah) Um, so that’s first thing. The second thing is, and I think it was President Obama who once said, this is I think he said this in one of his books. And if I misquote it (Lesley: It’s alright). Okay, (Lesley: Their already coming for me and Joe) I think he said. (Lesley laughs) Yeah, it’s it, you know, like, yeah, exactly. He said, like, “Act as if.” I think it was him. It’s one of the things because people were I think, if I’m not mistaken, somebody asked him when he was a junior senator in Illinois, “How did you ascend to become the president?” is like, almost unheard of in that way. He’s like, “I just had to go into rooms and act as if. Act as if I was the President. Act as if, as if I was a senior member of the Senate. Act as if I belonged in the room.” So when I say that, I don’t mean it from like, an imposters way or like, trying to, you know, alpha it or become the dominant person. It’s like, just go into like, act like you own it. (Lesley: Yeah) Because most the secret that I love to say and I don’t know if you feel this way, but I really do as most people don’t know what they’re talking about or doing most of the time anyway. (Lesley: No) Like, they have their they have they have training, you know, like all these all these experts and gurus out there and I’m like, “These people don’t know anything more than you and I do, they just have good shiny sales and marketing.” And yeah, if you just like …

Lesley Logan 32:14
100% correct on that. I rem…

Jason Frazell 32:16
I mean in the fitness industry is full of people like this, right?

Lesley Logan 32:18
Oh, 100… I’ll be in the rooms. And I’ll be like, “Oh, my God …” And I hear like, “I have, I’ve been trained by people vigorously.” (Jason: Right) Like I haven’t like, oh, it’s just that they acted as if, they put themselves out there, they took the risk. So you know, I mean, like, I think we tend to put people on pedestals who are actually our equals. And if you met them and actually talk to them, they would see you as an equal as well. Like …(Jason: They would) were (Jason: Yeah) putting them up there when they’re like, “Hey, I’m just right over here with you.”

Jason Frazell 32:18
Yeah, I’m just right over here with you. And I just but the thing I think that, that a lot of those people do. And you know, some of I do think there’s some snake oil stuff out there. (Lesley: Oh yeah) There’s a lot of good people who are have this kind of, you know, like same place. What they are willing to do though is get uncomfortable. And share themselves in this kind of like, they’re willing to show up. (Lesley: Yeah) Even when, even when they’re not ready. And I think that’s one of the things that holds back a lot of people, especially in entrepreneurial space. Especially personal brand space is being willing to show up and speak your truth and let the world know who you are without it having to be perfect. Because to me, there’s no such thing as perfect.

Lesley Logan 33:20
Yep. … I mean, that’s a mantra around here, “Perfect is boring. Do it messy.” …

Jason Frazell 33:27
Yeah, that’s a that’s a mantra at Brand Builders, too, is like we’re not gonna do it perfectly, but like we’re gonna do it. We’re gonna get out there. We’re gonna do it.

Lesley Logan 33:33
Yeah, well, cuz I’m one of my favorite people on this planet, Jill Coleman says, “Perfect is the like the thing keeping you from being consistent.” (Jason: Totally) You know, and so and honestly, most of the people doing things that you’re like, “Gosh, someday when I’m ready.” They weren’t ready. They weren’t perfect. They just were consistently showing up. And so yeah. Well, Jason, thank you for being here. Thanks for being on the Be It Till You See It podcast. I can’t wait to be on Talking To Cool People. Oooh (Jason: Yeah) (Lesley laughs)

Jason Frazell 34:03
Yes. Lesley, thanks, thank you so much for having me. It’s a delight to be here with everybody.

Lesley Logan 34:07
Oh, you’re amazing. This is a great conversation. And everyone please screenshot this tag @jasonfrazell, tag @be_it_pod. Let us know your takeaways. Let us know how you’re going to act as if and how you’re going to use these BE IT tips. And until next time, Be It Till You See It.

Lesley Logan
That’s all I’ve got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It podcast! One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate this show and leave a review. And, follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to podcasts. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the @be_it_pod on Instagram! I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us help others to BE IT TILL YOU SEE IT. Have an awesome day!

Lesley Logan
‘Be It Till You See It’ is a production of ‘As The Crows Fly Media’.

Brad Crowell
It’s written, produced, filmed and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan and me, Brad Crowell. Our Associate Producer is Amanda Frattarelli.

Lesley Logan
Kevin Perez at Disenyo handles all of our audio editing.

Brad Crowell
Our theme music is by Ali at APEX Production Music. And our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.

Lesley Logan
Special thanks to our designer Jaira Mandal for creating all of our visuals (which you can’t see because this is a podcast) and our digital producer, Jay Pedroso for editing all video each week so you can.

Brad Crowell
And to Angelina Herico for transcribing each of our episodes so you can find them on our website. And, finally to Meridith Crowell for keeping us all on point and on time.

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