Understanding Masculine

and Feminine Dynamics

Ep. 281 with Lesley & Brad

“Being embodied in feminine energy is saying no to what doesn’t feel good.”

Lesley Logan

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Show Notes

Brad and Lesley offer a fresh take on Kelli Adame’s relationship coaching techniques. Discover the nuances of masculine and feminine energies, the essence of setting boundaries, and the pitfalls of achievement-based identities.

If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at [email protected]. Or leave a comment below!

And as always, if you’re enjoying the show please share it with someone who you think would enjoy it as well. It is your continued support that will help us continue to help others. Thank you so much! Never miss another show by subscribing at LesleyLogan.co/subscribe.

In this episode you will learn about:

  • Recognize the importance of setting clear boundaries.
  • Identify societal pressures and their impact on how we perceive and value achievements.
  • Reflect on personal energies and the necessity of balance.
  • Recognize the importance of respecting your partner’s energy in the relationship.

Episode References/Links:

Transcript
Lesley Logan: I just ladies want to highlight that your boundaries that you enforcing your boundaries is actually you being in your strong feminine energy. And there’s nothing more you can do for the people around you. But be in that energy and enforce those boundaries. It will change all of your relationships.

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Lesley Logan
Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I’m Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I’ve trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it’s the antidote to fear. Each week, my guests will bring Bold, Executable, Intrinsic and Targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It’s a practice, not a perfect. Let’s get started.

—-

Lesley Logan
Welcome back to the Be It Till You See It Interview Recap where my co-host in life Brad and I are going to dig into the evocative convo I have with Kelli Adame in our last episode. If you haven’t yet listened to that episode, feel free to pause this now go back and listen to that one and then come back and join us. Holy frickin moly.

Brad Crowell
It was evocative.

Lesley Logan
Is that how you say the word?

Brad Crowell
Yeah, evocative.

Lesley Logan
I’m great. I’m glad. I loved her the first time I heard her. I loved her more on my podcast. And we already have her scheduled to come back. So I hope you love her because she’s coming back.

Brad Crowell
I’ve really enjoyed the convo. I actually listened to the whole thing twice.

Lesley Logan
Oh, I know. I was interested to hear what you thought about it. Because it’s, I think it’s interesting to talk about, it’s worth talking about masculine feminine energies and like what those things are. And I think we also talked a little bit about like feminism and things like that. And like, a little bit yeah, I think first of all, ladies, we always have thought all this amazing power. And we’ve got to stop thinking we’ve got to fight for it. We just have to take it and then enjoy that we also have this incredible power. It’s she’s so amazing. I hope you all

Brad Crowell
I thought it’s very freeing because it was it kind of gave a permission structure to be both masculine and feminine. (Lesley Logan: Yes.) And like energetically and the fact that we actually are (Lesley: for both people) was interesting for me.

Lesley Logan
For both and, and look the she was she was very aware that like she was talking more in a heterosexual relationship sense. However, this happens in same gender, you know, relationships and in different things. So I think it’s really important to see yourself in the story, but it’s true. Like I think a lot of people get a little confused on like, what is masculine? And what is feminine energy? And it’s Yeah, I think even for myself, like I can do those things, too. And she’s not saying you can’t, she’s just saying she’s saying it when you’re in a relationship, here’s a way that can actually make the relationship work better. And, and also, it doesn’t mean that you who’s listening to this episode, who’s deciding which energy you’re showing up as has to be the one who’s gonna do that work. The other person has to show up doing their work too and she talked about how she and her partner support each other. Anyways, we’re gonna do this in a second.

Today is National Transgender Children’s Day, Fuck Yeah, way to go tell your parents all the parents out there who got a child who’s going through that. You’re amazing. You’re awesome. I so glad to see them. And for those who want a different holiday today, it’s also Worldwide Howl at the Moon Night so I hope you choose both. I hope you celebrate both that would be my ask of you but you know yeah. So there you go. We just got back from Cambodia. And we are going to be opening up the doors to our next Cambodia retreat in the new year so go to Lesleylogan.co/retreat and the reason you want to do that is because you want to be on the waitlist because the waitlisters get the best rate of the retreat. (Brad Crowell: They do.) and the public gets a different rate.

Brad Crowell
And they also get first dibs so there’s limited spots. Yes. Yep.

Lesley Logan
And November I am going to be in Chicago you want to DM me for that link. There’s all kinds of options, there’s full weekend options I have a masterclass there. Also we’re coming to that time of the year where you if you wanted to be in my mentorship program eLevate or if you’re wanting to see about the tour we’ve got lots of info on that so just hit us up if you’re wanting to know about eLevate if you’re wanting to know about the tour, on our socials we’ve got all the things. And December we’re going to be on our huge epic tour and our sponsors are working on an incredible prize and all these things so you do not, (Brad: Yeah, we’re really stuffed.) you want to make sure you’re getting the emails, you’re gonna make sure that you are heading to one of the min stops we’re going on. It’s a 7000-mile tour so it’s big.

Brad Crowell
Yeah, 14 cities, y’all. It’s gonna be big.

Lesley Logan
It’s huge. Babe, do we have an audience question before we talk about Kelli?

Brad Crowell
Today? We do. So you were recently asked for your live YouTubes that you’ve been doing with Andrea Maida. You’re asked by a by someone, what is the piece of Pilates equipment that you could not live without?

Lesley Logan
Yeah, she had a bet with her husband and I fucking hope she made money I or got whatever the bet was. This is a hard question. And she and I both cheated. Because we’re like, because I do think the mat is an apparatus, but I was like when we can get into the mat. A special mat. So I chose the one chair because I just the Contrology (inaudible) my fucking favorite. And because I could do the mat next to the chair. Do you have a favorite? You don’t like the mat that I know.

Brad Crowell
I don’t I don’t hate the mat. But I

Lesley Logan
Well, that’s because, you know, you’d have to do it twice not because you know the rule. If you don’t like something, it means you need it. So you have to do it two times.

Brad Crowell
Oh, well, I was just thinking I’m so used to a yoga mat that it’s really difficult to switch over to the Pilates Mat, because it feels like squishy compared to the floor. But (Lesley: You’re on the floor.) I like the reformer.

Lesley Logan
Oh, okay. That’s cool. I love that good for you. If you have a question that you’re wanting us to ask you just send it into Be It pod. We love to answer them. There’s no question that’s too small or too big. We love to do it. So make sure you send it in to us.

Brad Crowell
Okay, now let’s talk about Kelli Adame. Drawing on her education as a depth psychotherapist, Kelly offers transformative insights as a relationship coach. She’s passionately committed to guiding individuals towards authentic connections and nurturing healthier romantic relationships.

Lesley Logan
Yeah, I really was so excited about this. I thought it was really fun, because we haven’t had like a be it till you see it in relationships. Really, especially like for those who are like, existing in one already. And so

Brad Crowell
We had a sex therapist, but that wasn’t quite the same thing.

Lesley Logan
No, that’s, that’s, I think that’s a little bit. I mean, they’re they should meet. (Brad: Yeah, they should totally, totally connect.) Um, so this one really spoke to me the most because and shout out to Tasha, because she actually just posted recently when the time we’re recording this about boundaries, that they’re actually you can be kind and have boundaries. But she said this. Kelly said this part of being embodied in feminine energy is saying no, to what doesn’t feel good. Ladies, did you hear that? Being you don’t, it’s not nice to do things that don’t feel good. It’s not nice. It’s not good to like have no boundaries. In fact, you’re more embodied in your feminine energy when you say no to what doesn’t feel good. So you get to have really clear boundaries, it’s actually crucial for your feminine energy. No wonder so many women are burnt the fuck out because they’re trying to be liked or kind or people pleasing. And they’ve lost their boundaries. I’ve just like, fucking listen to that again. She said, it’s, it’s our societal conditioning of saying, Yes, we’re so conditioned to say yes. And to just do it. But then we get resentful about that. Yeah, of course, because we’re no longer in our feminine energy. And that’s not fun to be in. And that results in resentment. And that’s not fun.

Brad Crowell
Yeah, I actually liked you know, the, under the breakdown of the difference between masculine and feminine energy and then effectively, like the actions that you are taking with one or, you know, not with the other. And I didn’t realize that since, you know, all people can be are both have both are at different times, like leaning into one or the other. I didn’t realize that effectively, the work, the working world that we know of, everyone’s leaning into the masculine, masculine energy.

Lesley Logan
Yeah, we’re, we’re all leaning in really hard. And then what’s affecting is the people who do want to live in their masculine energy more, feel a little bit lost, because everyone’s just like living in it 24/7 And we’re not, it’s like a dimmer switch or like, a on like, an open and closed office hours, we’re not actually we blended our office hours to being at any time all the time. And so it’s really about like, some when you work in the things that are masculine energy, like really leaning in that. And then when you when you when you’re not supposed to be in the energy, like really owning your feminine or your masculine and, and honoring each other’s energies because of that.

Brad Crowell
Yeah. Well, and I think that ties right back into the boundaries, because, you know, I know that like, what what ends up happening is that we get stuck in the work mode, masculine energy, even when we’re at home, like you were saying, especially because of work from home world now, you know, and then having a boundary a clear boundary of like, I’m allowed to shift gears. It’s really hard for me to permit myself to shift gears because I feel like I have to stay in this, you know, work mode work, work, work masculine energy, and sometimes like shifting into relaxed mode or, you know, whatever, like creative mode when I shift into that, I almost feel guilty about it. But I think it’s because I don’t have a commute, like I used to have in my old job right, I had a hard break in my day, where I was like, super high, intense focus, focus, focus, putting out fires, and then I had my drive home. And when I got home, it was like, permission to shift. You know, so that’s been really interesting, you know, working from home these past few years. Well, how do we create that boundary?

Lesley Logan
I slowly lost my commute as well. You lost your commute even sooner? Well, I mean, I guess you had a long (inaudible).

Brad Crowell
I’m not complaining about losing my commute. It wasn’t my favorite thing I ever did. But it was a marker in my day.

Lesley Logan
But it was like a really good like the switches turning. Yeah, yeah, you’re correct. We need to figure out a new commute, in air quotes, because we’re not

Brad Crowell
Well, I mean, it’s a little bit turned into cooking dinner for me.

Lesley Logan
Yeah. Yeah, I think that’s a good, that’s a good commute. Anyways, I just ladies want to highlight that your boundaries, that you enforcing your boundaries, is actually you being in your strong feminine energy. And there’s nothing more you can do for the people around you. But be in that energy and enforce those boundaries, it will change all of your relationships. And sure, you’re gonna piss some people off, but you’re gonna feel fucking good about it. That’s what I love. Anyway, what do you love? It’s okay to not be liked by everyone full permission.

Brad Crowell
Yeah, it’s hard for most. It’s hard for me.

Lesley Logan
Yeah. Same. But also, you know, some people don’t like me, I actually don’t like them. So it’s okay.

Brad Crowell
Fair, I really loved when she was talking about identity, and how we are inadvertently tying our identity to our achievements, because of the way that our society operates and how we were raised, you know, winning in soccer, or, you know, scoring a goal or getting a medal or getting an A on a test or any of that shit applying to colleges and getting in getting a job. All it feels like this achievement, like we’ve got this is achievements, we have to hit along the way of life, right. And so we taught, we end up tying ourselves to that, that mode of thinking, and then also the achievements themselves. And if something fucks up with one of your achievements, then now you apparently no longer have any value. Yeah, you know, like, we do that to ourselves.

Lesley Logan
Oh, I was. I’m sorry, parents are listening. I know you are. Love you. But I distinctly remember them coming to pick me up at school and my progress report came out. And because there was some C’s and some B’s and some A’s, but there were C’s for the first time in my progress report, marching back to the teacher and being upset with me, because I had C’s. And luckily, the teacher explained like where I needed to do some improvement. But looking back, it would have been nice if they had understood the the the effort in I was doing to get those C’s and that the achievement of the A B’s and the A’s and B’s don’t actually reflect who I am as a human being, you know, and think like, I think I got paid for straight A’s, I got paid money for that. So I was like, conditioned to achieve. And I there’s good reason for that. Thank you, I got the fuck out of house, I’m good. But it as an adult, having to learn how to be a recovering overachiever has been a journey, because it actually doesn’t fucking matter if we win at any of our goals, it actually does matter how I treat myself along the way. And having to be okay with not achieving has been really hard.

Brad Crowell
Well, you know, she she talks about how the achievement, you know, culture basically, how it really affected her life, you know, because, you know, then you start getting a little older you start dating, and she said when she was starting to dating, it turned into like, you know, or I think it was her client actually was looking at her life and saying, you know, I’m, I’ve achieved all these things. Right? So therefore, I must be wanted, right by others. And so,

Lesley Logan
And it’s so interesting, because my clients in L.A., they’re all these high-achieving women. And they felt like they needed to play down their achievements because people didn’t like them so that made them feel like they had to hide their true selves. And I was like, Well, I think your achievements are pretty awesome. But I guess you don’t like, when you when people ask you like, so what do you do? You don’t feel like list off every achievement you’ve ever had. This is not your TED talk.

Brad Crowell
Yeah. And she, I mean, you, too are joking about, you know, you know, you don’t go out there saying, like, I’m looking for someone with six medals on their wall to date, like, right, you know, that’s not what the that’s not what ends up happening. No. And if that is what ends up happening, then you, you know, might not be the best situation. But, you know, the, I just thought it was interesting. Because I definitely know that I understand that, like, viscerally because when my band stopped playing, when I had moved across the country to Los Angeles to play in this band, and two years later, it stopped. And I was lost. I did not know what to do with myself. I didn’t know how to introduce myself. Everything I was was Brad’s in a band. And then, and then Brad wasn’t in a band. So I was like, well, what’s the fucking point?

Lesley Logan
So interesting? Because it wasn’t like, I mean, that’s not to knock you. But it’s not like your band was like, playing on the radio.

Brad Crowell
No. So like, we were still getting our feet wet. We were trying to play shows and like music and stuff.

Lesley Logan
Just being able to say I’m in a band. Yeah. Was like it meant so much to you. But more than that the band like wasn’t actually doing the things you wanted to do. Yeah, because the band because when I met you, you were in a band. Yeah. And when we that was, like, third or fourth band, but yeah. And then we officially started dating. You quit that band? And I thought, oh, fuck did I cause this mi am I Yoko?

Brad Crowell
Yeah, well, the whole band stopped. I mean, I think it was.

Lesley Logan
Side note, I just wanted to say, Yeah, listen to you’re wrong about podcasts about Yoko, because she did not fucking kill the Beatles. And we’re not going to blame that on that woman. Because I’m tired of blaming women for things the men didn’t get along.

Brad Crowell
We’ll get, we’ll get a link to that episode in the show notes.

Lesley Logan
The reason the Beatles aren’t together is because they didn’t get along. It’s not because of her. Just defending.

Brad Crowell
I don’t know, that whole story. I love it. Well, anyway, you know, just the fact that we were kind of raised to do that. And so what happens if we shift out of that achievement? Performance, you know, gear, and then how do we define ourselves? Outside of, you know, I’m Dr. So and So who, you know, sailed around the world six times, you know, like, what if it’s just like, you know, I’m, I love sailing, you know, and, you know, it’s kind of tying those things together. And then, you know, it’s the act of doing things instead of achieving the thing.

Lesley Logan
Yeah, I think that’s why I love Pilates so much, because, like, at least the way I practice it, and the way I teach it, it’s like, it’s actually not about, I’m a Pilates instructor. Or, like, I can do the long side massage, whatever. I love, every time I hit my practice, it is like I’m doing my practice. It’s not. It’s not a perfection thing for me. And it’s a process, I get to process that I get to be in and get to be enjoying the journey of it. Yeah. And that doesn’t mean I love it, that journey all the time. But I think that it’s nice to have something that I’m that I am in, in the process of and not attaching myself to its performance. Anyways, it’s pretty fucking awesome. There’s so many guys, this is a really deep app, I really had a hard time ending the episode. So we don’t even have enough time to recap every awesome thing she said, You have to listen to it.

Brad Crowell
Yeah, go back. It’s worth it. All right. So finally, let’s talk about those Be It Action Items. What bold, executable, intrinsic or targeted action items can we take away from your comvo with Kelli Adame?

Lesley Logan
Usual first?

Brad Crowell
Yeah, sure. She actually she said, decide primarily which energy you want to sit in? Do you want to primarily sit in feminine energy? Or do you want to primarily sit in masculine energy. And then she said, understanding which energy you lean toward, can guide you in finding a complementary partner and foster a healthier dynamic.

Lesley Logan
I I love this, because I think this really actually lends itself to however you identify yourself as a person and like, what kind of relationship you’re in. Somebody gets to spend money in your romantic relationships, somebody gets to be in the masculine energy and someone has been the feminine energy and one of you, like, you have to respect your partner and one of the chair’s like there’s a giving and receiving that’s happening. And if you want to be in the mass energy at home, that’s okay. You can, but these are the things you have to do. So that the other person feels part of that relationship, and they have to receive it’s a whole thing. So go listen to it because I really enjoyed it’s a give and take. I mean, it’s a back and forth, and well that’s why that’s why marriage can’t be 50-50

Brad Crowell
Well, yeah, and you were talking about this that like you were talking about the author drawing a blank. Is it temporary? No, Brittany, we’re talking about oh, hey Brown, right? And that her example of like a different times of the day, even the ball shifts back and forth. Are they flipping? You know, back and forth?

Lesley Logan
I’m like, this is the energy. I hate. I’m sharing about 30. Today, and like no problem, I can do the rest. But if they’re both from the 30s, and they go, okay, so what are we going to do right now? Right? We don’t hurt each other, kill each other in this relationship. And I love that because

Brad Crowell
I didn’t realize they were that like, like intentional about it.

Lesley Logan
they’re just I don’t know that it’s like, all day long. But like when they come home from their workday, because they both actually have a work day. And then they have a commute, and they come home. And they ask each other how they’re doing. According to her interview. They say, like, Hey, I’m at a I’m at a 30 today, right? Got no problem. I’m having a great day. I’ll take up, I’ll pick it up.

Brad Crowell
And well, I Well, I think that it’s interesting to have noticed that in our relationship too, like, you know, when I’m having a bad day, you know, it’s, I hope you can pick up the slack. And say, Well, yeah, but that’s what I’m saying. Like, when you’re having a bad day, I’m there to pick up the slack. And that, and that’s how we will try to work together.

Lesley Logan
And I love that Kelli said like she mentioned like she was having she was feeling something. And then her her husband, because he’s aware of the work they are integrated is like, what do you what can I do for you? And she’s like, here’s what I need right now, which I think is really important. I think we don’t spend enough time with ourselves to know what we need. And I think that’s one of my bit my take away. But like so we can actually verbalize here’s what I need right now. From the person that I’m in relationship with to give me that. The Tim Ferriss thing I don’t know if I talked about in the episode with Kelli, but I distinctly remember this time when he was doing like a when it was tequila night q&a. And someone said, like, I’ve been single for a really long time. How, like, what, how do you find someone who’s compatible for you? And he said, I don’t know why you’re asking me this. This is not something I’m really familiar with. But here’s how I’ve seen it. If you take maths like a like a spectrum, and you put highly masculine on one end and highly feminine on the other end. And they’re like polar opposites, then wherever you are on that spectrum, your equal opposite is actually gonna be the most compatible for you. And I was like, This is Oh, that’s so genius. With like, Kelly, what she’s saying, because I actually think that you and I are on weren’t neither one of us is like, towards the ends of the spectrum, but we’re in the middle either. And like, I feel like we’re pretty compatible in that way. That’s a that’s a really fascinating and a cool visual. Yeah. Because if you look at it, like if you we have some friends of mine, right, like, we’re like, they’re like, those like 1950s like lovers, like where the girls like the pinup girl and the guys like very, you know, like greased lightning and like, yeah, they work together, because they’re like, pretty much on the spectrum of feminine masculine, like equal opposites. You know what I mean? So, it’s, it’s, it’s very fascinating to me how that that very simple spectrum works. And I think it goes along with what your Be It action item was, I’ll go into mine. Yeah. What about you, because I kind of talked about this, she, she talked about learning how to identify and regulate your own emotions and feelings. And it’s very valuable. And they’re just as valuable as your rational thoughts. And so she said, really checking in with, like, what feels good to you? Does this feel good to me? So, and this goes with anything like if you’ve got a, we have people in our business coaching group where the clients are taking advantage of them? And they’re like, I don’t know how to do this, like, Well, does it? Does it actually feel good to you how that’s happening? Right? Like, does that feel good?

Brad Crowell
And then same with managing a team? Yes. Or you know, whatever. And then

Lesley Logan
Once you’ve asked yourself, pinpointing your emotions like figuring out how you’re actually feeling and this is really key because I think a lot of times we tried to like shove our emotions and and qualify them or change them or I shouldn’t feel that way, no, like, how does that make you feel like today? Before I recorded this I was like, fucking feeling upset about something because it really hurt my feelings. Like just didn’t feel good. And just verbalizing like what didn’t feel good actually made things better. Yeah, but like just doing that and then given this which is that given that I’m feeling that way and sort the way you’re feeling right there, what can I do to make myself feel better? And y’all if you haven’t spent enough time with yourself to know what makes you feel better, then you’ve got some homework to do.

Brad Crowell
Well, I mean even doing this is hard. Ah, because you have to be able to identify that and like stop the cycle first and then you ask yourself the question Does that feel good to me? And then you say why can right so you have to be aware enough to last kind of from an objective perspectives

Lesley Logan
Yeah. And and also my perfectionist overachievers you’re gonna get fucking wrong. You just are.

Brad Crowell
You’re never like, you’re not like watching yourself on the side and all the moments?

Lesley Logan
No, but I think like one of the I’m so grateful for the therapist I had a while back. Who made me listen a bunch of things that I thought would make me feel good about, like spending my time. Like, she’s like, just make a list, like what would make you feel good. So I wrote like, of course, breathwork, meditation, like all the things that like, sound really good. And then I wrote down, like going for a walk. And I wrote rock climbing. I wrote journaling, and I wrote reading a book, and I listen to music, and I wrote down all these things. And then what I had to do is like, being conscious of when I was like, feeling like out of control and looking at my list and go, Okay, well of these things. I’m looking at this list that I made when I wasn’t feeling like a crazy person. Have this list? What would make me feel better right now? What do I think that makes me feel better right now?

Brad Crowell
So you actually have a list in front of you? Yeah. And you can refer back to it because in the moment, you’re like, I can’t remember.

Lesley Logan
You need to do it when you’re feeling good about yourself. Yeah, it’s a great idea. Do it in the morning, when like, the day is your oyster. Yeah, you know, and like, make a list and then have that list handy. Have it on a card, have it on a note in your phone. And then when I was feeling that, I would look at the list and I would try out the first the first thing that made me think I would make me feel good, cool. And I was kind of myself if it didn’t work, but sometimes just taking action, especially if especially any part of what you’re feeling is fear. Just taking action really is shockingly helpful.

Brad Crowell
Also, with especially with fear, like talking about it out loud, even if it’s only you. Oh, it’s really

Lesley Logan
Go listen to Chris. Because it’s it’s important kind of crazy. How quickly taking some sort of action feels good. Anyways, Kelli’s coming back. Yeah, that was great. She’s phenomenal.

Brad Crowell
You know. just there was really tough to pull out like, what to talk about in this recap, because there was just a lot there.

Lesley Logan
Life changing. I hope I need to write a book. Anyways. I’m Lesley Logan.

Brad Crowell
I’m Brad Crowell.

Lesley Logan
Thank you so much for joining us today. How are you and use these tips in your life? What are you going to do? Are you gonna let your partner listen to this? I hope so. What a perfect person to share this episode with. You know, what you could do to make yourself feel really awesome right now is share this episode, it’s going to be really great and you and especially if your friend needs to be in a receiving mode, they should receive that very well.

What a great practice. Have an amazing day and Be It Tll You See It.

Brad Crowell
Bye for now.

Lesley Logan
That’s all I’ve got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate this show and leave a review. And, follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to podcasts. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over on IG at the @be_it_pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us help others to BE IT TILL YOU SEE IT. Have an awesome day!

Lesley Logan
‘Be It Till You See It’ is a production of ‘Bloom Podcast Network’.

Brad Crowell
It’s written, filmed and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan and me, Brad Crowell.

Lesley Logan
It is produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.

Brad Crowell
Our theme music is by Ali at APEX Production Music. And our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.

Lesley Logan
Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals and Ximena Velasquez for our transcriptions.

Brad Crowell
Also to Angelina Herico for adding all the content to our website. And finally to Meridith Crowell for keeping us all on point and on time.

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