Reading Strategies for Improved Book Retention

Ep. 373 Nick Hutchison

“I love helping people retain and implement more from the books that they read.”

Nick Hutchison

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Nick Hutchison is the visionary force behind BookThinkers, a thriving 7-figure marketing agency bridging authors and readers. In just over 7 years, he has cultivated a platform reaching over 1,000,000 people monthly and hosts the top 2% global podcast, “BookThinkers: Life-Changing Books,” featuring interviews with renowned authors like Grant Cardone and Lewis Howes. Nick’s platform and services have empowered countless authors to reach millions of readers, driving substantial revenue growth. His services encompass video production, podcast booking, and social media brand building. With a mission to inspire readers to take action, Nick authored “Rise of the Reader,” delving into mastering reading habits and applying newfound knowledge to unlock potential.

Show Notes

Explore the power of reading with Lesley Logan and guest speaker Nick Hutchison, author of ‘The Rise of the Reader’. In this episode, Hutchison reveals how he evolved from a non-reader to devouring over 100 books annually, offering actionable tips on selecting books, effective note-taking, and applying what you learn. Learn to set SMART reading goals and balance your Entertainment to Education ratio to maximize personal development through literature.

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In this episode you will learn about:

  • How Nick evolved from a non-reader to a prolific book reviewer.
  • The crucial lessons Nick learned from early product failure.
  • The importance of feedback and iteration in successful entrepreneurship.
  • How James Altucher’s influenced Nick’s approaches to idea generation.
  • The motivations and processes behind ‘Rise of the Reader’.

Episode References/Links:

Nick Hutchison: I have used these books in my twenties. I just turned 30. To become healthy, wealthy and happy. And I’m like, I know everybody else can too, because these books are condensing decades of somebody else’s greatest life lessons and lived experience into days of reading. It’s the greatest shortcut ever, but people aren’t using them the right way. We’re not taught how to retain and implement from books.



Lesley Logan
Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I’m Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I’ve trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it’s the antidote to fear. Each week, my guests will bring Bold, Executable, Intrinsic and Targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It’s a practice, not a perfect. Let’s get started.


Lesley Logan
Hello Be It babe. Oh, my freaking goodness. This is gonna be a great episode. Nick Hutchison is our guest. So I’m just going to let the cat out of the bag right now. And I’m just going to tell you just really, really excited because I don’t always get to meet our guests before I have them on and I got to meet this person. You’ll hear all of the things about that in the interview. But there’s something really special about knowing how amazing they already are before I get to bring them on (inaudible) and best way and I just really think you’re going to love today’s episode. I mean, I think that all the time. So obviously you’re like, duh, Lesley, of course. But no, truly, we’ve had on a lot of authors in the past, and they’re always talking about their awesomeness. But we’ve never had someone actually tell you how to retain that awesomeness. And next book is called The Rise of the Reader. And he’ll tell you more about it, but you’re gonna need to go get it. So you can just go to the show notes right now and just buy it, of course, because his tips on how to retain what you’re reading are going to also help you retain what you’re listening to this podcast. And so anyways, this is just a fabulous episode with a great human being who you’re going to hear his journey of how he became a voracious reader, and he didn’t grow up that way. And so if you’re listening to this going ah, Lesley, another book person. I don’t read. This is for you. This is absolutely for you. You don’t have to have been a reader to become a reader. And so thank you, Nick, for being an amazing guest. Here he is you guys, Nick Hutchison.

Lesley Logan 2:30
All right, Be It babe, I’m so excited. I got to know this person in real life. And when they stood up to introduce themselves I’m like, that is really cool what they’re doing. That’s really amazing. And then, by happenstance, he was put at the table to sit next to me and I got to hear how freakin intelligent he is. And just really how well he’s able to distill down to certain problems and help people solve them. But more importantly, he’s also an amazing author who really gets people reading. So Nick Hutchison, thank you so much for being here. Can you tell everyone who you are and what you rock at?

Nick Hutchison 2:54
Yes. Thank you so much for the opportunity. And you forgot to tell everybody that I got to drive you to the event.

Lesley Logan 3:00
Oh my God. That’s right. Okay. Okay. This is really funny, you guys. He said, oh, I have a rental car. And I was like, I don’t know how far this hotel is from this place. So I better get in on this car. So you were our chauffeur. Thank you so much. In the rain. I appreciate it.

Nick Hutchison 3:16
Nick Hutchison, chauffeur extraordinaire. So my name is Nick, I grew up in the Boston, Massachusetts area, I was not much of a reader growing up, which we could dive deeper into in a minute. But somewhere in my early 20s, I discovered the world of personal development books, and I fell head over heels in love with it. So I started a company called BookThinkers today. We’re an agency that helps authors promote and market their books, we’ve got a bunch of cool services, I decided to write my first book, Rise of the Reader, back in November. And that’s when it launched. And so I love helping people retain and implement more from the books that they read, the podcasts they listen to, the events that they attend. And then I also host my own podcast where I do a deep dive on a book with an author. Lesley is going to be on that podcast sometime soon. So I’m really excited for that. And that’s who I am. I’m just passionate, curious, a lifelong learner. And I love books.

Lesley Logan 4:11
Okay, so I have to go back to though, you didn’t grow up being a reader. I grew up being a reader. That was, my parents were like, you can have books, but they didn’t buy it. We had to go to the library. We were constantly in the library, I would get as many books as they let me check out and I’d read them as fast as I could so I can get more. But how did you become a reader later, and then on this journey to push more people to read, I think it’s kind of crazy, since that wasn’t what you did when you’re younger.

Nick Hutchison 4:34
You know, it’s funny, I grew up around reading as well. But I think that somewhere along the way, I started to be a little rebellious. And I realized that in the traditional public education system if you’re being forced to read something and you’re being forced to conform with how they think the book should be read and talked about, I just didn’t like that it didn’t sit well with me. I also fell into being a little bit more of the athletes stereotype not really much of the academic right? So I played football and I was captain of the wrestling team. And you just couldn’t pay me to do my homework. I was capable. I was in AP classes and stuff. But I would famously rock a zero percent homework average. So I was just not into the idea of being a nerd or whatever. And I sort of looked down upon books, which was a mistake. And that attitude continued with me through, I’d say most of my college experience as well. I was in the dining hall and the gym playing basketball, not in the classroom. But all of that changed for me when I took an internship at a local software company, going into my senior year of college, because I was commuting an hour each way. And my boss at the time, Kyle, he recognized that I had some we’ll call it unfulfilled potential. That’s probably a nice way to put it. I was a little rough around the edges, a little arrogant, a little bit of a know it all. And he said, Listen, man, you’re commuting an hour each way. That’s 10 hours a week in the car. Why don’t you try listening to some podcasts, because podcasts will teach you something, they’ll get you closer to your potential, but listening to the same song or the same playlist, to the same radio station is not going to help you in life. And so I did, I started listening to all of these amazing podcasts. And very quickly, to make the long story short, I recognize that a lot of the successful people being interviewed on these shows, they were giving at least some credit for their success to the books that they had read or we’re currently reading. And I’m like, okay, books are dumb, but I might as well give it a shot, because that’s what everybody’s telling me to do. And the rest is history. I’ve been reading 50 to 100 books a year ever since.

Lesley Logan 6:32
That is amazing. Okay, I love that because it’s true. I used to commute before, before podcasts were a thing. Like I had a little bit of a commute in my college years. And it was the radio and it’s just the same songs. And it’s just the same host doing the same beats all the time. And so I was so excited. Like I was one of the first people, I don’t know if I was the first people, but I was on the podcast before people knew that app was on their phone. It was like, when it first came on, I was like, what is this? And you’re right. That’s when I started reading again as an adult because I had read so much for school, I didn’t have time to read outside of the classroom. And so when I started listening to like, Tim Ferriss, they were saying the favorite books to gift out and I was like, what are these books and so I bought them and they’re, you know, some of them are simple as like the Four Agreements, which I live my life by, like changed my life. So I really do love that journey and how you got there. Okay. So you then turned into helping book, I just don’t know how you went from software company to okay, now I’m gonna help people who write books, get their books out there.

Nick Hutchison 7:31
I’ll break it down for you. And by the way, Tim Ferriss was one of my first podcast inspirations, and I consume a lot of his content. He’s totally changed my life. And then the Four Agreements, Don Miguel Ruiz, another amazing book. So we have a lot of things similar there. Okay, so I go through this internship. And I realized that I love the world of selling, I continue with this internship and continue reading books throughout my senior year, I graduate and they offer me a full-time position. So I take this full-time job and I start reading books on sales and marketing and negotiation and persuasion and effective communication, I apply them to my role, and I start experiencing a lot of financial success as a result of it. And I’m just shocked that no matter how much I talk about these books, my friends and family and co-workers want nothing to do with it, right a bunch of, you know, early 20s, sort of like jock types that are like I don’t want to read. So I start posting on social media, the books that I’m reading, because I wanted to connect with like minded people and see what else was out there. And my current friend group was having nothing about it. So I start posting the books I’m reading on social media, again, really with no expectation for growing an audience or anything but just to see if anybody else has similar interests. This was before Bookstagram, before Book Talk, this is back in 2016-17. And before you know it, I have an audience and quickly after that, I have authors reaching out to me saying hey Nick, I love your book reviews can I pay you to review my book as well and I’m like

Lesley Logan 9:03
That’s great.

Nick Hutchison 9:04
I’m like get paid to read like who wouldn’t want to do that? So I built BookThinkers brick by brick, stone by stone whatever you want to say as a side hustle for a couple of years after that, trying different ways to help authors promote, market their books before I went full time with it, but that was sort of like the transition point.

Lesley Logan 9:21
I think this is really cool. I love it because first of all, you are proof that niching down is like the best thing to do because your whole gram was just about books.

Nick Hutchison 9:30

Lesley Logan 9:31
And I also, what I really love is like you didn’t have it all figured out first and then you did it like you just kind of did the thing and let it evolve to what it is and I find a lot of people that we work with that we coach they’re like wanting to develop all the parts they have. They want all the pictures. They want the product, and the course and then the how they’re going to do their thing and it’s like yeah, but you’ve put haven’t put it out there yet. You don’t know what the feedback is going to be. You don’t know you’re gonna like it. And so I love that you just kind of did it for fun and then allowed yourself up to see what it can become. That’s really cool.

Nick Hutchison 10:02
Yeah, can I tell you a story about a big mistake I made not playing it that way in the beginning. So early in this process, I recognize that people in the industry that read a lot of books, they have a hard time retaining and implementing what they read. And so one of my first ideas for monetizing my passion of books was to build a mobile application. They’ll get to help readers retain and implement more from books. You can log your biggest takeaways, you would get put into this reiteration system. I thought it was the coolest thing ever. And I got together with a couple of my friends, we pulled together some money, right? Tens of thousands of dollars, we spent hundreds of hours of our time outsourcing and building the development of this app. And it totally flopped. Like, nobody wanted it. And that’s because we did what you just highlighted not to do, we assumed that everybody wanted the same thing that we wanted in our brains, we didn’t test, we didn’t collect feedback, we didn’t put out an MVP and iterate. We just built a finished product. And it had no product market fit whatsoever. And so I was like, super defeated by that for a little while. You know, thankfully, I was connected to a purpose, which I think is important. But yeah, I made a lot of mistakes. I think that we’re expensive, both in terms of money and time to learn that lesson of don’t assume what your audience wants, collect feedback and grow more organically and it’s more sustainable that way too.

Lesley Logan 11:24
Oh, my God, we did that. We did that in 2016. I became known because of my business skills as a Pilates instructor. I became a Pilates instructor in 2008, when everyone’s canceling their cable, and people are paying me for private Pilates sessions. And so I got hired to teach all these workshops. And I found people wanted coaching calls. And I was like, okay, what if I create like this coaching website that would help all these Pilates instructors and be a nominal fee, it’d be $50 a month, and they could come and they could learn and all these things. And so Brad built this insane website that like some stuff was in the front. But then some was like, behind a paywall, like on the New York Times, just like that, and I put it out there, and I promoted it, and no one bought it. Zero people bought it, no one and I did it month after month, I was pretending like it was working. And I was like being it until I see it. And no one bought it. And I don’t like, embarrassingly only for me, because no one even knew it really existed, shut it all down, redo a whole website, started over, and it was so funny, Nick, because what I ended up doing was like just doing one of the parts of it over and over again every month. And people pay me more for one part than I was charging for the whole thing. And what I learned is you have to get feedback and to see what people think before you do anything. So, been there.

Nick Hutchison 12:43
So incredibly important, you know, and one of those four agreements, don’t take anything personally, you know, another like, don’t make assumptions. I think that in business it’s important to build with your community and collect feedback. And a lot of authors, by the way, they make that mistake, they just put out a finished product, all of a sudden, they’re like, hey, social media following, buy this book. And it’s like, no, you should have included your community as you were building it, you should have put up multiple cover iterations and had your audience vote, you should have put out multiple subtitles and had your audience vote, you should have asked them if the information you’re writing about is actually what they want to read before just assuming, and writing a book. So again, like this applies not only to business, but books and sort of everything in between. I think

Lesley Logan 13:27
That’s amazing. That’s actually really great feedback. I didn’t do that with our first flashcard deck. Partly because I was afraid, I’ll tell, I’ll be really honest, I was afraid people would steal the idea. And I also was a little bit nervous that it wouldn’t do well. And so I was trying to put all of it together. So I didn’t really like only my members knew what I was creating, but the public didn’t know. And I feel like it was successful-ish. I feel like it could have been even more successful had I brought people along the journey. And so when I was doing the second deck, I did bring people on the journey. And it was insane what happened when we launched that. And I’m like, looking back, I’m like, you know, it’s really like, James Altucher, that’s the podcast host. And he said this and it’s perfect that his name came up to my brain right now. Because he said, “Less than 2% of people will ever take action on idea.” He’s like, here’s 17 ideas I have for businesses, I’m gonna tell them on this podcast, because I know less than 2% of you listening will even take action to see if it’s a valid business model. So no one’s basically, no one’s going to steal my idea. And I should have listened to that advice at the time.

Nick Hutchison 14:30
Yeah, I love James. I’ve had the chance to interview him and spend some time with him.

Lesley Logan 14:35
Stop it. Are you kidding?

Nick Hutchison 14:36
Yeah, he’s the best. He’s the best. We did an episode on my show for his book, Choose Yourself. And in that book, he talks about something related to ideas called Idea Sex, and I love this idea. So he’ll just say, take two random words, take Pilates and take Stanley Cups, you know, water bottles, and just write out a bunch of random ideas on how they could work together like should you be creating Pilates-specific Stanley Cup designs or like whatever, you never know what’s going to come up from it. But that’s how you get novel ideas is you combine two totally unrelated things. And I actually teach people to do this with the books they’re reading. So you could take a book on the science of intermittent fasting and you could take a book on leadership, and you could just merge them together. And now you have intermittent delegation or something where you only delegate tasks once per week instead of throughout the work day. And then boom, now you have something that’s super cool and new and efficient. But you never would have had it unless you merged them together. So shout out James Altucher for inspiring both of us in a big way.

Lesley Logan 15:39
Oh my gosh. And also like, if I, he would be a dream guest, just he has no idea. He has no idea, like the fangirl that I was. But he was like with me at 5 a.m. every morning, I would listen to his podcast when I would go on a run. He was like, because you guys, so I tell the audience this all the time. If you can’t afford to invest in coaching. You can’t afford to invest in people to help you. You can’t afford to have Nick help with your book idea or me to help you with your Pilates. It’s like if you’re listening to a podcast, and you treat it like you paid for it, he helped me build my business. He has no clue.

Nick Hutchison 16:11
I will make that introduction for sure. Consider it done.

Lesley Logan 16:13
Oh, that’s amazing. Yeah, thank you. This is awesome. Okay, so tell me about, tell me about your book like you, so first of all, you’re doing BookThinkers before you wrote your book. So I want to know, like kind of why you chose that route versus doing the book first and BookThinkers.

Nick Hutchison 16:30
You know, I think you can probably resonate with this to some degree. But when you have a large social media audience, sometimes you accidentally become a source of credibility for something that you didn’t intend on originally, right? So I’m reading these books, I’m applying the information, I’m sharing my thoughts on social media, authors start reaching out and saying, hey, I’d love you for you to post about my book and I build the business side of that, right? I’ve got 10 people on my team working with a couple hundred authors a year now. Amazing. But along the way, that social media audience continue to grow. And that’s full of readers, right? Not authors. And so people start asking me all sorts of questions. I received some variation of the following questions hundreds and hundreds of times. Hey, Nick, how do I choose the right book to solve my problem? How do I take effective notes while I’m reading? How do I retain more I feel like the books go in one ear and out the other? How do I take more action? Like, I read the books, but my behavior doesn’t change? I’m trying to overcome the resistance, but I’m not moving. What do I do? And so I wish there was a book I could have just recommended for everybody that would solve this problem. But nobody had written a book about implementing personal development material. And I knew I had the answers. So I just started to feel the questions and answer them, and then collect those answers and start to build out a book, essentially. And it was a lot more difficult than I thought it was going to be. It took me a couple of years to put it together. Because I first had to observe my own behavior, like what the heck does Nick Hutchison do to implement these books so effectively? I mean, I have used these books in my 20s, I just turned 30, to become healthy, wealthy, and happy. And I’m like, I know everybody else can, too, because these books are condensing decades of somebody else’s greatest life lessons and lived experience into days of reading. Like, it’s the greatest shortcut ever. But people aren’t using them the right way. We’re not taught how to retain and implement from books. So I started to build the book. And every single time one of those questions came in and encouraged me to continue to take action, because I’m like, there is a very clear need for this information out there in the world. So in November, it launched and I’ve been so thrilled with the feedback. But that’s how I decided to go from like helping authors promote and market their books, to deciding to write one myself. And of course, I got to test all of my own services, which was cool.

Lesley Logan 18:58
This is really cool. I want to highlight for everyone we take for granted what comes easy to us, like you had an there was an ease of which you were implementing what you’re learning, that’s possibly because like you had a boss tell you like use your time to read and then you are taking what you’re reading and implement it in your work. And so like it just became a thing. But we tend to think everyone does it like that. Everyone retains everything that they’re reading because that’s what I’m doing. And oftentimes, it’s not the case and what you’re the most expert in is the thing that comes easy to you. But it seems so silly because it comes easy to you. You know, I think that that’s just something I always have to take away. It’s like, oh, this comes really easy but it’s probably not easy for other people.

Nick Hutchison 19:34
Yeah, I remember this, this period early into, so I was a recent college graduate, I was flying all around the U.S. with a sales team making presentations and going on-site to visit customers. It was a B2B software sale, kind of pretty complex, lot of variables and stuff, decision makers. And I’m reading books all about how to navigate this more smoothly. And I remember I’m sitting at a bar in Chicago with my same boss, still at the company. And I remember him saying like, how many books are you reading every year right now? And I told him and he’s like, and you’re taking notes on all of them? I’m like, Yeah. And he’s like, and you’re then using those notes to implement what you’ve learned in your role and test it? Like, yeah, and he goes, that is weird man. Who does that? Yyou know, we’re sitting there over a couple of drinks. And I’m like, you’re the one that got me into the space. And he’s like, but I’m not doing all of that. So that’s when I first started, think about how abnormal it was. But you’re right, it came easy to me. And to sort of tell a little bit more of this story, the software that I was selling, it would go, it would be implemented into a company, like the company that would purchase it over the course of 4, 6, 8, maybe sometimes even as long as 12 weeks. So it take that company a long time to integrate our software. They would have to show up to training calls. They’d have to do their homework. They would have to provide questions. It was pretty intensive. And if the companies didn’t go through that process, they would fail. But if they did, the software would help them grow their business. Same thing with the books, it’s like, if I put this book through a four, eight, call it maybe even a 12-week implementation process. It’s going to help me live a better life. But if I don’t, I would argue that the book is closer to a form of entertainment, that it is education if you don’t use what you’ve learned. You know what I mean?

Lesley Logan 21:24
You and I and I know a lot of people who do a lot of self-development. And I’ll have a lot of people who sign up for coaching with me or even with Pilates with me. And they think because they signed up then they get the, they get the results from the signing up. It’s like, no, you have to do the thing. And like, so one of my coaches was like, information without integration equals constipation, like, if you just keep taking in information, but you don’t integrate it, like it’s gonna suck.

Nick Hutchison 21:49
Yes. I love that line.

Lesley Logan 21:52
Isn’t that great? It’s so great. Shout out to Samantha Skelly who I heard it from first. And it’s like, I just really love it. Because anytime I’m like, taking things and I feel overwhelmed, it’s like, oh, I’m just probably not integrating. It doesn’t mean you have to integrate all of that we’re gonna have Aaron (inaudible). Sorry, Aaron, I don’t know how to say your last name. Anyways, we’re gonna have her on, because she has the 50% rule, which is like, like 50% it. So you’re not a perfectionist about it. Try to integrate some of it, as opposed to all of it. So I want to go into your book, because you guys, I read a lot. And I don’t really unless I share what I just listened to or actually read because I do both audible and physical books. I don’t retain it. It’s like a podcast that I listened to, you know, on a walk. So but you have a whole thing on how I can learn how to like, learn it, like how to like, effectively take notes and like, retain it. Was that the easiest part of the book to write, the hardest part? Do you find people use it? What’s like, what? Because I know book like, I’ve read Jim Kwik’s book, and it’s how to read fast, but I don’t remember learning how to retain anything.

Nick Hutchison 22:55
Yeah, I love Jim too. Funny enough, Jim was the second guest ever on my podcast (inaudible). Yeah, he’s an amazing guy. And I went to send Jim a copy of my book. And he’s like, oh, I just bought copies for everybody on my team anyway, so you don’t need to sell one. I’m like, okay, that sounds super cool. I was like, that’s like a hero buying your book, you know?

Lesley Logan 23:18
Woah, that’s crazy.

Nick Hutchison 23:21
Yeah. So you’re right. Jim’s book, Limitless is is sort of about, you know, it talks about the possibilities of our brain, it talks a little bit about how to read more efficiently. It talks about some brain-boosting foods. But you’re right, he’s not talking about how to retain and implement more from books. So my book has only been out for a few months. So far, the reviews have been amazing. I’ve had a lot of people who are like, hey, I finally get it, I finally get how to take more action. So I do know that there are some people out there using these strategies and frameworks to get more from books and live up to their potential. Like, that’s my whole message is that life doesn’t have to be so hard. You can live an amazing life, a lot of other people have figured it out. You have access to the healthiest people, the wealthiest people, you know, on planet Earth, the happiest people on planet Earth, because they’ve either written a book or a book has been written by them. So yeah, then there are all the tools and strategies for actually taking that information and integrating it into your life. And they are a little detailed, you know, I tried to simplify them as much as possible. But as you know, from writing a book, like that’s a hard process.

Lesley Logan 24:30
It’s so hard. And then also because I reread my book, because I wrote it, you guys, in 2013. Self-published it. And then like, as known as I thought I was, you know, I wasn’t super known enough yet, but it went out there and it was shocking. I would go to conferences and there would be book people selling my book at a Pilates conference. So it was really, really cool. And I was trying to hear from people who’d bought it. And we’re coming on the 10th year anniversary and my team was like we want to edit it and rerelease it and I had to sit down and read my book. And you know what? Like, I don’t know, maybe you don’t know this, but I was like, Oh my God, this stuff is 10 years old, like, How bad is it? Like people are buying it right now? And like, how bad is it you guys, it was fucking great. It was actually really amazing. There was only a couple things. I’m like no one calls it a web page anymore. Let me edit that out. But like, it was actually really brilliant stuff. And I when I wanted to add more stuff, I found myself editing it back out because I’m like, actually, that’s succinct, it’s enough. And if they need more, there’ll be more, but I can’t. If I keep adding on, it’ll be too overwhelming for the reader who’s getting it. And so we’ll just have to figure that out for them. But it is hard to be succinct. It’s hard to get everything down but have everything be detailed, but not too much. Don’t get me wrong, but I also know that like, people listen to podcasts, they love details. And so they love knowing exactly the next step. Okay, so if I go out and I say I did this, like what do I do next, like so it’s gonna be I think that for a lot of people, it’s exactly what they want. Because I think it’s really cool that you even take notes that I don’t do, I’m an underliner. And then also you write in the front of your book, like when you started reading the book, that’s really cool, because that’s also good memory jogger actually.

Nick Hutchison 26:14
Yeah, and something that you’ll get into as you continue with the book, as well is I teach people to set a SMART goal for each book that they read. So smart is a goal-setting framework, a lot of us are familiar with it. S stands for Specific. M stands for measurable. So what’s not being measured can’t really be managed. So we need to set a goal that’s measurable. So we know whether or not the book helps us achieve it right? A stands for attainable. So you need to set a realistic goal. If you try to consume too much in that example, before you get constipated. You don’t take any action, you procrastinate. So it needs to be realistic. R stands for relevant. So you need to be emotionally connected to the information. Is the book solving a problem? Is it building a skill? What is the book going to do for you and ask yourself, why are you reading it like really get connected to taking action. And then T stands for time-bound. You want to give yourself a deadline to take action as well, Parkinson’s law’s the idea that a task will expand to the amount of time that you give it. So if you don’t ever set a goal for taking action with a deadline on the book, you probably won’t take any action. So when I pick up a brand new book, we’ll say Limitless by Jim Kwik, I set a SMART goal, something like find and implement at least one new speed reading strategy by the end of March. That is specific. I know what the goal is, it’s measurable. By the end of March did I implement at least one new speed reading tactic? Is it attainable? Yes. I didn’t say like 5x my reading speed just implement one new strategy? Is it relevant for me? Of course it is. I read 100 books a year, like any efficiency boost is a positive thing. And then time-bound, by the end of March. And so I’ll also write that intention on the inside cover of the book and then review it every time I read another chapter. So that it’s almost like I’m sharing my goal with the book so that the book can share only the actions that I should take back with me. And that’s one step in my process. But I just wanted to give everybody a little flavor for maybe some strategies, some action,

Lesley Logan 28:16
I love it. And also, if you just got shocked by the 100 plus books a year, you guys in the first chapter, he actually explains really well, how that is actually very easily possible, even for the busiest person. So I love it because we had a guest on who said 30 minutes of your day is only 2% of your day. That’s it. That’s just 2%. And so in your equation, it was like 15 minutes. So it’s 1% of your day spent reading can produce as over 100 books. It’s kind of insane.

Nick Hutchison 28:46
So that math won’t produce 100 books, but it’s a starting point.

Lesley Logan 28:53
Oh, it produces 20 books.

Nick Hutchison 28:54

Lesley Logan 28:55
That’s still more than, that’s still probably 20 more books than most people are reading. At least 19.

Nick Hutchison 29:00
It really is. So sometimes I’ll meet people that tell me hey, Nick, I’m way too busy to read. Like I understand the value. Thank you for positioning it with all those metaphors. But I’m too busy to read. I’ve got kids running around, I’ve got a business to run whatever the excuse is. And I love to say okay, Lesley, if I paid you $10,000 to read a book by the end of next month, do you think you could do it? And you’re like, oh, yeah, yeah, of course I could. I’m like good. You’ve fallen into my trap because it’s not a question of whether or not we can read. It’s a question of whether or not we value the reading enough to prioritize it. So it’s about picking books that solve problems, picking books that build skill sets, because when you have like a specific outcome that you’re looking for, you’ll prioritize it. And that math that I gave in the book, instead of trying to find time to read just replace a little bit of a low-impact activity like scrolling on social media or watching Netflix with reading a good book and it could be as little as 15 minutes a day, and all of a sudden you’re reading a boatload of books every year solving problems, building skills. We tend to overcomplicate things but there’s one other thing that I throw in the book, which is an entertainment to education ratio. And most people are going to find when they go through the exercise that for every one hour of education they spend every week they’re spending 10 plus hours a week on entertainment. That’s not a winning ratio in life. You know what I mean? So we just need to sacrifice a little bit more of that short-term dopamine hit, Netflix or social media, with something a little bit more productive, that serves our future self. And I think books are a great way to make that happen.

Lesley Logan 30:39
Yeah, you are absolutely correct. It’s like pretty much everything that started the businesses that I have and the success I have came from hearing it in a book or the author on a podcast and talking about their book because it’s because it’s your, you said it already and I want to repeat it, it’s like any book that’s out there is someone’s expertise condensed into a book. So you are actually going, you’re jumping through hoops, you’re speeding up the time, you don’t have to learn all of it on your own. You can learn it from someone else.

Nick Hutchison 31:11
Yeah, and I had a mentor of mine, tell me recently, he’s like a business coach of mine. He said, Nick, I would rather read somebody’s book than get a full day coaching session with them. And I was like, why? And he was like, it took somebody years to consolidate that information and simplify it, which we talked about how hard that is, so that it’s easily digestible and actionable. It’s the best of what they’ve got. But in a full day coaching session, and there’s a lot of value in coaching, obviously. But in a full day coaching session, you’re not going to get that three years of effort boiled down to the perfectly digestible action items, like you’re gonna get a bunch of random stuff. And I was like, that’s an interesting perspective, you know? Like, you really can get access to all of your favorite entrepreneurs and authors and speakers and coaches in their books. Like, it’s so cool.

Lesley Logan 32:02
Yeah. It’s so cool. It’s so cool. You’re so cool. All right, we’re gonna take a brief break. And then we’re gonna find out where people can work with you, read your book, all that good stuff.

Lesley Logan 32:11
All right, Nick, where can people buy your book? Where can they find BookThinkers? How can I stalk you and learn more from you?

Nick Hutchison 32:17
Here’s my favorite way to end conversations like this, if anybody listened, and they’re a reader, and they’re like, okay, Nick, you’ve inspired me to take a little bit more action, but I don’t know where to start, then you’re going to love what I’m about to say. I love to play book matchmaker, it’s my favorite thing to do. And it’s totally manual, but I love doing it. So anybody here can direct message me on Instagram, @Bookthinkers, and tell me about a problem that you’re facing or a skill that you want to build and I’ll provide a custom book recommendation to you. Sometimes it takes me a few days to get back to everybody. But I love to provide custom book recommendations that are aligned with what you need, not what I think you need, you know what I mean? So that’s my favorite thing to do. So BookThinkers on Instagram, and from there, there are links to my book and our website. If you’re an author, you can check out the different services and set up a call. There are sales team and everything else is over there.

Lesley Logan 33:13
Amazing. You guys. His book is called Rise of the Reader. So we’ll make sure the links are in the show notes and also your Instagram. And I will, don’t be surprised if you find me in your DMs (inaudible). Okay, so you’ve already given us so much and your book has so many amazing action items in it. But for the listener who needs a little like too long, didn’t listen, or just one more reminder of a great action step they can take. Bold, executable, intrinsic or targeted steps they can take to be it till they see it. What do you have for us?

Nick Hutchison 33:39
Here’s what I recommend, do a little personal audit and find one problem that you deal with on a daily basis that you just can’t get rid of. It could be small, it could be big, it could be related to your personal life, your professional life, it doesn’t matter. But what problem, what pain do you experience on a daily basis? And by the way, to hammer this point home, if you don’t fix it over the next 30 years, so 365 times 30, you’ll experience that problem almost 11,000 more times. So here’s your chance to do the little personal audit, identify the problem, and then go out there and find a book that can help you solve it, right? Like as human beings, we think that our lives and our problems are unique to us. But they’re not. Almost 100 billion people have lived on this planet, many of them have found a solution to the same problem that you’re tolerating. And so for $20 and a few hours of your time, you can go find a book, apply that person’s solution that may have taken them decades of trial and error to figure out and you can solve your problem and then you’ll get addicted to doing that. That’s the power of these books. So my action item, to reiterate it is do a little personal audit, find a problem that you’re dealing with, go out there and find a good book, read it and solve the problem and see how amazing it feels when you do that.

Lesley Logan 34:56
I love it. I love it. I’m gonna do that right now. Thank you, Nick, for being so amazing, for giving so much great, awesome advice, you’re just a gem. And I’m excited to complete your book because I know it’s gonna help me with so much. And Brad, I put here a copy next to his bed so he can also take it in because he is not the ferocious reader that I want to be. But when he does read a book, I can see him implement all those things into how we work. So I’m actually really excited for him to continue to do that. So you’re amazing. You guys, how are you going to use these tips in your life? What are your favorite takeaways? Please tag Nick at BookThinkers and the Be It Pod and let us know what your takeaways were. And then share this with a friend who you’ve been listening to the daily problem they have and you just want them to fix it.

Nick Hutchison 35:39
Your life gets better that way too.

Lesley Logan 35:42
Yeah, I’m one of those people. I’m like here you should listen to this. And until next time, Be It Till You See It.

Lesley Logan
That’s all I’ve got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate this show and leave a review. And, follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to podcasts. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over on IG at the @be_it_pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others BE IT TILL YOU SEE IT. Have an awesome day!

Lesley Logan
‘Be It Till You See It’ is a production of The Bloom Podcast Network. If you want to leave us a message or a question that we might read on another episode, you can text us at +1-310-905-5534 or send a DM on Instagram @be_it_pod.

Brad Crowell
It’s written, filmed and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan and me, Brad Crowell.

Lesley Logan
It is transcribed, produced and edited by the epic team at

Brad Crowell
Our theme music is by Ali at APEX Production Music and our branding by designer and artist Gianfranco Cioffi.

Lesley Logan
Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals.

Brad Crowell
Also to Angelina Herico for adding all of our content to our website. And finally to Meridith Root for keeping us all on point and on time.

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