Your Practical Tips for Intuitive Living

Ep. 301 Rachel White

“You have to have a little bit of faith that something works out.”

Rachel White

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Known as “The Skeptical Shaman”, Rachel White is an unusual spiritual practitioner. Blending more than 25 years of high-level corporate innovation and strategy experience with a deep knowledge of the world of woo, Rachel is making waves with the “crystal hippy people” with her fresh, pragmatic take on spiritual development. Rachel is the host of The Skeptical Shaman podcast, the Owner of TOTEM Readings—her Austin, TX-based spiritual practice– the author and publisher of the TOTEM Tarot Deck, and the purveyor of TOTEM Flower Essences on her TOTEMReadingsATX Etsy Shop. She is also the author of the TOTEM Readings Substack, an engaging community that challenges preconceived notions of what it means to “be spiritual”. Rachel is married to her Chef husband, Bradford, and they take care of their wolf-dog in beautiful Austin, TX. In her spare time, she maintains her organic garden, “researches” micro-dosing, and writes all about the mystical and esoteric.

Show Notes

Explore Rachel’s unique perspective on spirituality and strategy with Lesley. Discover the role of tarot reading, using your intuition in making fulfilling life choices, and how a grounded approach to fear aids decision-making and balancing life’s various pursuits.

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In this episode you will learn about:

  • Rachel’s journey on spirituality through tarot and shamanism
  • Why trust your intuition in making fulfilling career choices.
  • How to strengthen your ‘intuition muscle’ with regular practice.
  • Learn the power of ‘allowing’ in life’s journey.
  • Discover how digital detoxes can spur creativity.

Episode References/Links:


Rachel White: It’s not get a crystal ball out and control your entire future. It’s the understanding that through doing things you will learn experientially and that you’ll be able to incorporate that and hone things or even if you test hypothesis and it’s faulty. You’ve learned something that’s a successful experiment.



Lesley Logan
Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I’m Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I’ve trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it’s the antidote to fear. Each week, my guest will bring bold, executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It’s a practice, not a perfect. Let’s get started.

All right, Be It Babes. I’m excited. Okay, so I really, I’ll be honest, I was like, okay, a skeptical Shaman. I’m a little skeptical about a skeptical Shaman. What does that mean? Are they really skeptical? Are they and they are they being Rachel, why our guest today? I feel first of all, there are so many. There’s never been anything that’s random. The this the timing of this, this woman being women in our lives and your ears right now. It’s really cool. And she said so many gems that have everything to apply that to your life that are not necessarily around tarot, or astrology, or any of that stuff. And so what I whether you have are like someone who’s like, oh, a shaman and like that’s a turn off for you. Stop, keep listening. She is awesome. She we talked about the journey for her switching careers. We talked about the journey and like being a small business owner in having to make decisions that like not everyone’s gonna like, and also intuition and allowing, and there’s some stuff on digital detox in there. So this is a really great episode, get your notepads out, have some fun. And then also make sure you check out all of her amazing things, if any of these things intrigue you because I am as soon as I get off this I am. So here is Rachel White.

All right, Be It babe. I’m actually really excited and intrigued by today’s guest. I’m not gonna lie. There are certain things I’ve dabbled in as a one woo girl in this world, and I do have some crystals. But I also like to think of myself as like pretty logical about some things. And I, I do have some tarot cards, but I also am like, okay, but like, and so when today’s guests came across my plate I was like, oh, well, I’ve always been a little skeptical about a shaman. So why not have Rachel White the skeptical shaman in our, in our group today? So will you tell everyone who you are and what you do?

Rachel White 2:57
Of course, yeah. And it’s funny because people see skepticism as inherently in opposition to spirituality, but I don’t and I think what how you just described yourself is, personally what I perceive most people are, and they’re very underserved by the crystal hippie people and I also have crystals. But you know, there’s a certain archetype. So yeah, I’m Rachel White. I own a spiritual practice called Totem Readings. And I have a new podcast called the skeptical Shaman. And the whole basis of the show is conversations with all different kinds of people, cynics, skeptics, true believers, different faith systems, you know, some of them seemingly quite crazy. Like I had a Catholic exorcist on, I thought that was an interesting discussion. Because to me, curiosity and skepticism are like they’re two sides of the of the discernment coin. You don’t get anywhere without being curious. And as a part of curiosity, you’re like, and what’s in that? What’s this? And what really is that? And most people prefer to navigate life that way. And yet, when you enter the world of Woo, sometimes people make you feel like it’s very binary. Like it’s all or nothing, you know, and it’s just not the case. I’m glad you’re doing it the way you’re doing it.

Lesley Logan 4:14
Thank you. I’m always here for the affirmations. Those are my love language. But I, I think I love that you point that out because so I live in Las Vegas, which I think is a really interesting place to live. It’s got lots of little there’s something for everybody here for sure on any side of any coin, but I remember going to this one event, and going they were speaking in a language that I heard the words I heard them they are all words that are like in my English vocabulary, but the order in which they were coming out I was like, What are they saying? And I kind of just felt like, it’s like but I I love breathwork I love my crystals. I love a new moon. I don’t understand what you’re saying and I was like maybe this isn’t my place or I think it your to your point like sometimes some places are very it’s very binary. You’re all in or you’re not? And I’m like, no, no, I still have to go into my world where I pay mortgage. The credit card doesn’t care if Mercury’s in retrograde.

Rachel White 5:10
If a teacher, a spiritual teacher, a coach, anybody is working with you, but they’re not empowering you to make it pragmatically actionable in your life, and making your life better, whatever that looks like, they’re not really doing much for you. It’s a bunch of gobbledygook and what you just described as something that’s referred to as word salad, just so you know. And it’s designed to make people feel kind of stupid, like maybe they don’t understand. And it’s a disempowering, gatekeeping mechanism a lot of the time and I spent over two decades in corporate outsourcing and real estate, by the way, as I was working on totally off the side of my desk, and this one, I’m going to say next holds true for business, for corporate, for spirituality. If someone can’t explain something to you, and human scaling, words you understand it, it’s a bit of a red flag, they may not understand it, they might be trying to spin you out and like snake charm you or they want to sound really smart. And they want to condescend to you, because most people that are good communicators, they just cut to the chase, you understand them.

Lesley Logan 6:12
Yeah. Okay. Love you and that for all of that. So, I want to go back to like, first of all, because you just said you were in real estate, and you were doing on site. How did you get into this? Did it find you? Were you like, yeah, like, what, what was the what was like, I’m ready to leave the corporate world. How did that go?

Rachel White 6:32
So I was like, most people I know who are legitimate psychics, mediums, whatever you want to call it. And by the way, don’t get hung up on all that it really kind of doesn’t matter. I was very psychic. And then I pushed that to the side became a pretty smug atheist. Right? So I just like logic, I like things that make sense. And a lot of what I saw in religion, so I grew up Catholic was like, very tail nonsense thinking it just, you know, they were using a lot of thought-terminating cliches, and no one was using a lot of critical thinking. So I, you kind of threw the baby out with the bathwater. And then I had an experience that sent me into exploration mode, because the whole point of like, if you’re curious, and you’re skeptical, you have to let in new data, even if that new data’s Woo, that’s a part of it. And I was like, I have to reframe things I was wrong. Right, I have to add new stuff to my repertoire. So I studied it, studied it, and then started just doing it off the side of my desk seeing clients on weekends, I’d always read tarot cards. So that was sort of the first thing I brought in, to my practice, which people don’t think of is classically shamanic. But it is divination is a part of it. And then in March of 2020, transitioned to doing this work full time and it’s funny, corporate real estate is not doing well. And it’s one of those areas where intuition should serve you. And I just saw the writing on the wall, like and it wasn’t just COVID trust me, it’s not just office spaces and people working from home, there’s a whole bunch of things going on. And it would have been misery the last three years, I think. And so, you know, fault like pulled tarot cards or kept getting the death card, which is not bad. By the way, it just means like, let it go. It’s dead. Everybody tells you you’re dead. It’s time to lie down. And it’s scary as a rational person to I have moments less so now. But like last year, I’d be in the backyard go like, Oh my god, I make my living. I’m a tarot card reader. Like, what did I do? You know, and you’ll have those little, and they go real fast. And they leave as quickly as they came. But it’s a wild experience. Yeah.

Lesley Logan 8:35
Yeah, I understand that I am. There’s like, certain times in my life, I can tell when I truly listened, like to the intuition to these like, like, I don’t know, maybe I’m wrong. But I do feel like the more we listen to our intuition, the more psycho we all are, you know, we just often don’t want to or, or a lot, we, we pull ourselves out the way we tend to talk ourselves out of that intuition. Maybe someone told you, you know, you were wrong sometimes. And but the reason why we even live in Las Vegas right now, is because of one of those moments in 2020 when someone said something, and my gut said something and I was like, oh, it’s time to move. And if you hadn’t, if we hadn’t moved then I while I’m sure we would have done something else amazing. We would not be exactly where we are today. Because we could a month later we could not live in the neighborhood that we’re in right now. We couldn’t have afforded it. We couldn’t have made that switch as I’m a Pilates instructor. Like, you know, when you’re like when you like, strip away all the things that make us who we are, you’re like, and the title of this thing that I do is not something that people would think is a reliable, right.

Rachel White 9:42
But what is the reliable job now? And that was the other reason I transitioned. So most of my clients are like high functioning executives, business owners, lawyers, professionals, you know, whatever it is, and there’s so much turmoil and churn in the workforce across industries. geographies I have clients all over the world. And the new thing, I had a client, she works at a very prestigious technology company and is quite high up there. She said, I understand now that the side hustle is the hedge against the market. And for her, she’s an astrologer really. And she’s like, it would have seemed insane to me a couple of years ago. And now I’m like, that somehow feels more steady than even where I am. Because there’s no more rules. By the way, her coworker was let go via email giving birth on maternity leave, which is illegal, you know, labor law wise, they don’t care anymore.

Lesley Logan 10:35
They’re like, well then fight us in court, because that’s probably cheaper.

Rachel White 10:37
And she’s a top performer just won a big award. And it didn’t matter. Because it’s not it’s not a meritocracy up is down. It’s a lot of chaos. So what I would say to people is the myth of the steady, reliable, safe job, it’s not safe anymore. Number one, you know, doesn’t mean you have to be crazy, like me and do what I do for a living. But getting into something that is a passion, even if it’s just a hobby for a while getting certifications, exploring other things, developing skills, listening to your intuition in those areas. It’s it’s a really smart move, actually.

Lesley Logan 11:12
Yeah, yeah. I love that. Thank you for sharing that. And we don’t have to go off on this tangent. But I was talking with a girlfriend of mine, we both bought a house in the same year. And the amount of proof like, I was like, buying your first house is like the hardest thing you’ve ever done when you work for yourself. And I’m like, I’ve been working for myself for 15 years, excuse me, bank. If anyone can prove they can make money and be consistent look at me, I there’s no guarantee that if I had a regular job, I would still have it for all of those 15 years, no way. But every single day, the bank’s like, oh, we prefer the person who’s working for a company, this person who’s working for themselves, and it’s, it can be infuriating, and frustrating. And luckily for me on most days, it lights a fire under my ass. But like, let me just show you, let me just prove you a difference. Not that they’re paying attention. But I’m like, let me just prove you that you don’t know what you’re talking about. Because I can bet on myself every single day, when I can’t bet on an employer that I’ve had.

Rachel White 12:10
You can’t anymore and part of the work of developing intuition and getting to know yourself that way. Because I do think it’s sort of a perishable skill up to a point, like my husband’s a chef, right? And if he doesn’t cook, if he’s not doing these on plus, and practicing his knife skills they dull. And I do think like using intuition and developing that muscle memory with it throughout life so that you’re ready for those moments, you’re ready for like the buying of the home and that challenge or you’re ready for the corporate layoff or whatever the crazy thing is that’s coming. It’s not the first time you’re like, doing a gut check.

Lesley Logan 12:50
Yeah, okay. So yeah, can I ask you? Because I’m sure our listeners, my listeners, like they’re like nodding. And they’re like, okay, but as the perfectionist and overachievers we tend to attract on this show, what are some signs that they is their intuition that’s talking to them and not like someone else’s story that they’ve picked up?

Rachel White 13:10
Right? Yeah, the the number one thing I do, and this might not be for everybody, but there might be a version of this, anyone listening to this convert this two year thing? I pull a tarot card. And tarot doesn’t tell me what to do. It doesn’t tell anyone what to do. And you know, I have my own deck and all of that. And even then I go, No, it’s meant to facilitate your own work. And I will pull a single card in the morning for several days at a time, if I’m handling sort of a situation or assessing options. And I go to look for the consistency in the theme. And what it triggers in me like my you know, when you take standardized tests, they always tell you their first answer you think of is usually the right one. Yeah. And I take that direction. And then the other thing, the second layer of that is how much of this is fear. And frankly, using logic. So like, let’s say, let’s say I stay where I’m working, right? Let’s follow that thought exercise all the way through. How much am I in control? Like how much safer is this really, and getting really objective about it, even writing it down on paper, really thinking through it. And then the third layer, which is a little bit more shamanic, because we’re disturbed people is, you know, one day I’m gonna die. And that’s sort of it seems morose. But it’s actually a great way to prioritize what you’re doing and what’s fear versus what is excitement and how to assess all that. And I can honestly say, I’m 40 right now. I’m gonna have, at least on my trajectory right now, probably very few regrets in terms of, you know, I don’t think I’m gonna feel like I didn’t take risks that were meaningful, if that makes sense. And just doing like, letting yourself do things. I know so many people go, well, I wish I could write a book, but I have a job and I’m like, everybody’s got a job. I got a job. You can still write a book. You can like these things. You can do them. It It’s okay. But I’m also not one of those people. You know, there’s so many life coaches that say crazy shit. And one of the things I’ll hear from people is they go well, I was told that if I don’t quit my job, the universe won’t give me my next thing. And I’m like, no, no, no make money until you figure it out. What are you talking about? Yeah, that doesn’t show up when you just empty your calendar.

Lesley Logan 15:21
Yeah, no.

Rachel White 15:22
That’s wild.

Lesley Logan 15:23
Yeah. Yeah, I, I, you know, that like, leap, and the net will appear. And I was like, I like, yeah, there are some things like I do joke that like, I do a lot of things. Like I’m on a, like a roller coaster. And I’m doing it scared like I cuz yeah, I don’t know, the other side of things. But I remember like, I think it was Brene Brown, or somebody she was talking to said, I hate that line. I kind of think of it like, what would I would I be willing to do this, even if the net didn’t appear? And like, that’s kind of an easy, because it’s like, if I’m not willing to do it, if the net doesn’t appear, maybe, maybe I’m not there yet. But if I’m like, you know, I gotta do it anyway, no matter what happens, that’s something I have to experience, then you know, you’re not going to live your life with with, with regret.

Rachel White 16:07
And that’s a passion. And that’s intentional. But people being like, I don’t know what it is yet. But as long as I got this job paying me money, I’m not going to find out. I’m like, I don’t know that. That’s how the scavenger hunt works. Right? So there’s a happy medium. And, you know, I started a podcast, and as you know, it costs money. No, yeah. Right. You have to have a little bit of faith that something works out. The biggest predictor for me is just do I want to do it right now. It’s because I touch that intuition muscle a lot. And I go, I call it like, witch vibe, you get witch vibe of that stuff. And every time I’ve just done it, and it has that almost a somatic physical feeling to it. It always works out. And so if you practice this, you’ll learn and you get more comfortable. And generally speaking, people are good at something, they can recreate that success. You know, if they’re successful in a relationship, and then, you know, something happens, they can have another great relationship. Same with businesses. Yeah. creative projects.

Lesley Logan 17:04
Yeah, I agree. And I think like, even when I’m just hearing you say is like, you the questions you ask yourself, when you pull a card, these are things like, is, anyway, you can do it as a journaling thing, you can do it as like a talking to yourself thing, but it’s kind of like it’s not, it’s getting like a 30,000 foot view, and being a little bit more cynical around yourself versus like, like, it’s not talking to another friend to get your intuition. It’s being with yourself to get your intuition muscle.

Rachel White 17:34
Listening to the fear, you know, one of the gifts of like, tarot or a lot of these modalities is you’ll pull a card, in my case, it was the death card. And at the time, my, my deck was a prototype deck. This is my version of the death card, which is Anubis, it’s the Egyptian God of death. And I, I would tell myself, like, okay, that’s really interesting, that’s a big card, and you don’t judge it, you just kind of sit with it. And people can journal or I always like to see how the day goes, how I’m feeling what I’m noticing around me, and there was a massive reorganization at work, they were trying to get acquired by another big company I used to work for before that. And so you’ll, you’ll pull the card, and it might seem silly in a vacuum, right? That little noise in your head will be like, well, it’s just a random card. And then you observe what’s manifesting in reality, and you okay, that’s not that random writing’s on the wall. And, you know, using it as, as a means of getting access to your own spiritual data, is how I look at that. And, you know, pulling a card at the beginning of the day, even when you’re not in a situation, living your day, coming back and looking at it, and reflecting on how that manifested for me. So you build your own language with cards, or runes, or whatever you want to use, it doesn’t really matter.

Lesley Logan 18:43
I mean, I think like, it kind of goes even into the idea of like, we see evidence for which we believe to be true all the time. You know, like, if we want to our goal, our whole brain is like, Let me prove myself right. All right. And so what it sounds like you’re doing is like, in a way of, like, deliberate intuition is just is like kind of putting a piece of evidence out there and then allowing the day to unfold and just seeing how we interact with evidence or how that like, what is it coming back to and then reflecting on the end of the day, I can’t think of a better way to come up with your like, develop your intuition muscle or spend time with yourself. Because I feel like you get to end up being through your day more present as opposed to the day happened to you.

Rachel White 19:23
And it’s not a bunch of work. It’s not you know, doing DMT in Bali, or like, you know, it’s a minimal requirement because most of the people I work with and myself we’re busy, and I’m not one of those people where you have to like give an arm and a leg and do all this crazy. It’s because it’s like a diet. If it’s not sustainable you’re gonna have a hard time. Yeah. And it’s in the sustaining of it where you’re really going to get that that value right. And yeah, pulling a card Carl Jung love taro and my deck is very archetypal and Yang Yin and he would use it with his clients a bit like a Rorschach but around archetypes and a way of just getting you out of your own myopic nonsense and going like, Oh, that’s interesting. I don’t understand that. And then living your dang going. I totally understand that now. Yeah, I understand why that showed up. Yeah. And then next time, maybe a year from then you pull a card and you go, I know what’s gonna happen today. Yeah. And you have that confidence. And it’s rooted in. I mean, it’s not a scientific experiment, right? But it’s like, a little bit of a control experiment. You can run in your own life, you have a hypothesis, and you test it.

Lesley Logan 20:27
Yeah. Okay. So I’m kind of now I want to know, at what point does somebody go I need? I need a skeptical Shaman. I need it. Like, how? Why? Like, like, because because you do have cards. So I could just use your cards, like, at what point in my life? I need someone like you in my actual life regularly? Or is it? Is it just a moment in time?

Rachel White 20:51
I’m sort of notorious for not wanting people that come back a lot. And so I took my time building my practice on purpose, because I set certain intentions. And one of them was I don’t want to be one of those people who’s like, I need to see you every week. Yeah, the cards stay the same. I had a client push on it during COVID. And finally was like, You know what, it’s fine. Come back in. Because just a few months after reading, I usually tell people to wait like eight, nine, twelve months. There’s other stuff you can do. There’s stuff you can do on your own, right. But for a Tarot reading, it’s a snapshot for quite a quite a bit. And she came in with all the same cards, and they just slightly moved and she had had a picture and she goes, now I know why you didn’t want me to come in. I said, I don’t want to take your money twice for the same information. And also as a practitioner, no offense, it’s boring. To tell you the same story. I like to meet with people when the tectonic plates have shifted, and there’s something new and that’s fun work. So a lot of people reach out when they’re at a bit of a crossroads. Not like an intense one always but just like I don’t know, I have a job. I don’t love it, or I got laid off. But I don’t know what I want to do. I don’t want to get back in the same industry or maybe I had a breakup but I’m meeting people it’s not clicking. Some people really want to go deeper into the spiritual work like soul’s purpose. You know, what’s my sort of mission for being here spiritually? So I do like Akashic Record, work and some channeling work and we get their their guides in, which is a little bit more of a shamany thing versus just a straight up you know, telepathic clairvoyant, psychic thing. I always joke that I, I stay out of the way, I’m just a broker, and other people come to the meeting. That’s sort of how it works. And so yeah, and from my practice, I work with what I call, it’s sort of a joke, but it’s accurate, the spiritually homeless, like, they know there’s something going on, they’ve had experiences, but also they’re not they’re not buying everybody’s bullshit all the time. And, and so they want someone who’s just going to kind of talk straight to them. And who’s going to say, I don’t know, sometimes like my if my, just yesterday, someone asked me a question. I had a big event here at my place in Austin. And I said, I don’t I don’t know they go, What do you mean? You don’t know. I said, I honestly, I don’t know the answer to that question. It’s interesting. Yeah. And she was so like, taken aback. Like was willing to say, I don’t know, just honest. I love knows everything. That’s crazy.

Lesley Logan 23:08
I love that though. Like every, like, there are certain things you’ve said, I’m like, thank God she’s not a cult leader, okay, okay.

Rachel White 23:14
I don’t ever want that kind of pressure. I’m the least likely to be a cult leader. I’m so funny. To the point of clients are like, hey, what about this? And like, I don’t know, did you Google it? I get so exhausted with that. And I don’t need that kind of attention. It would drive me nuts. I was a people manager in corporate. I’m good on that experience for the rest of my life. I mean, I like people as individuals. I love those little sessions, you know, the event, you know, hanging out with my friends who were practitioners was great. Yeah. But it’s i that is an interesting psychology.

Lesley Logan 23:47
I know. That is I but I, but I hear you because like, so I used to be a teacher trainer for like new teachers and Pilates. And I really at the time, I really wanted to be that like, I really wanted to have that experience. I saw something I mostly wanted to recreate a better experience for every other teacher, because my first time was not right. And then after about six years of that, I was like, you know, I’m good on that. Like, they ask a lot of questions. And you do need to have an answer because they are new. And they yes, they need that. And I got to a place where I’m like, I I don’t I don’t want to have to be that for you. I really want you to be able to like grow and bloom and so now I have a mentorship which took me I dragged my feet and I team and my coach was like you people want this from you. They want to learn from you. You’ve had an exposure, I decided with one of Joe’s Pilates clients. So I’m one of the few people out there who is close to the source supplies that that it’s out there and I’m not crazy. So and I’m kind and I’m me. So I dragged my feet because I was like, Well, I don’t want it to be like it’s this way. This is the answer. I really want and I really want people to be able to come and explore the infirmary question that I have and then integrate it the way they want. And that was interesting. So I feel really good about that. But sometimes people have signed up and they’re like, Well, can you just tell me the answer? And I’m like, so it’s not black or white. There’s actually, what do you think of it? And it’s so interesting, because like, people can want you to be that for them. And you’re like, No, no, I’m really good. I think can be hard, because of course, I want them to get the experience that they want to have. But I can’t be the control for them. They have to figure that out themselves.

Rachel White 25:30
Right. And you’re actually doing the ethical thing, but it is a harder stone. And it’s funny, my joke all the time I sell against myself constantly, right? Yesterday, someone said, your your spiritual transformation coaching program, it sounds really fun. I said, Oh, it’s it’s not fun. It’s spiritual transformation. And three of my clients that are in the program right now, and it’s all individual work, but I do it like at the same time, we’re here and they started laughing. And the woman was, well, they look really happy. I go, Yeah, but that’s like, crazy happy. So that’s another, you know, this is disruptive work. Ultimately, it’s very good for you. But it’s, it’s not a spa. And you know, and what’s funny is people will be intrigued by that. And then I don’t have to manage weird expectations that were off pace or whatever, you know, spiritual work, you’re gonna see some things and feel some things that are that are really intense, you know, and not all the time. But like, if that’s you dipping your toe, and there’s a bit of that at the front end. Yeah, for sure. And we’re not all like vending machines, have answers, right? Like, there’s a thing in our culture of like, I put the dollar bill in, and I push F-six to get the

Lesley Logan 26:39
twig. I do that. If you are listening to it. That means you’re too young for this podcast.

Rachel White 26:45
Oh, yeah. And you probably eat healthy, and I used to be a garbage. I was a raccoon I would eat out of vending machines all the time. Oh, yeah.

Lesley Logan 26:53
Are you kidding? I mean, I grew up poor. And I feel like

Rachel White 26:56
me too.

Lesley Logan 26:59
So yeah, I love that you brought that up? Because I do. It’s funny. It’s not. I feel like it’s just generations of like, just get the right answers so that you like because it would be embarrassing. You’d embarrass the family. If you’re wrong. You’re embarrassing yourself if you’re wrong. It’s it’s a failure if you don’t have it right the first time. And I feel like only in the last like, seven years of my life maybe really five have I really understood that. It’s like, it’s actually really cool if I get the wrong answer. And in my business, of course, I want to make money, I got bills to pay, we got this mortgage now. But we learned so much more from the things that didn’t go right in a project than we do when they like, like we had an event do so fucking amazing in May of 2020. So that’s why we bought this house we like literally made a downpayment in a weekend. It’s what entrepreneurs dream of right? And we have never recreated it. And I in trying to recreate it, we’ve learned so much. But from that I’m like luck and prepper like preparation met opportunity at that time people and may have wanted the information I had. And so the timing of what I did was exactly right. I couldn’t have done it. If I wasn’t prepared, of course, but we couldn’t, there, you can’t just recreate that, that extreme moment, you have to you learn more from the mistakes.

Rachel White 28:19
And it’s funny because you know, coming from corporate, I was an innovation director. And, you know, when you study innovation, you realize a lot of it can never be recreated. And it doesn’t mean you’re failing. And sometimes you can have the best idea, and everything lines up and nobody signs up. And other times you could have kind of a throwaway thing that just boom, and then other things come from it. And it’s not an indication of your personal failure or achievement one way or the other always like being prepared, being organized, being professional, that’s those are the variables you can control. So those should always be controlled, but the rest of it part of it is allowing. And that’s a really hard thing for high functioning driven people. And I’m one of those I’m a workaholic. Um, it what it really is, is a false illusion of control. Like if I work enough, somehow I can control things you can’t like, you don’t think about it consciously that way. But that’s really what it is, and being honest with yourself about it. And one of the reasons we had this event, I didn’t charge anyone anything, it was a party, literally like you’re invited my house. We’re going to feed you My husband’s a chef, here’s some drinks, we make drinks out of the flower essence mother’s because I make flower essences and had a party. And people were like, well, why are you doing this? There’s like it’s Equinox. And you know, tomorrow’s Yom Kippur? We’re happy Yom Kippur or whatever. Like, yeah, because it needed to happen. I don’t know why. Yeah, and we’ll see. Right. So I’m learning to like shake, move energy, like move chi sometimes just for the sake of moving it.

Lesley Logan 29:53
Okay, so I love everything you just said there. I can’t wait for Brad. My husband will listen to this and then we’re going to talk about you on the next episode.

Rachel White 30:01
(inaudible) to Brad’s, by the way.

Lesley Logan 30:02
I saw that I saw that, yeah, and my loves to cook. He’s not an act like not an actual chef, but like, loves to cook. And so He’s a chef in our household because I’m not cooking. But I love that you brought up allowing, and I’m wondering, like, can you go into that a little bit more? Because I do think that that’s something that especially the women Listen, this podcast probably need to do more of I think we all probably need to, but

Rachel White 30:28
I need to do more of it, too.

Lesley Logan 30:30
So yeah, what are you doing to allow more because I,

Rachel White 30:34
The big thing, my big case study that gave me permission to do more of it was the flower essence project, which wasn’t a flower essence project. Initially, it was COVID lockdowns in Chicago, Chef husband at home. You know, in Chicago, you’re not a house, there’s not a yard and you’re at the time we weren’t allowed to go to parks, right? You don’t have a large game.

Lesley Logan 30:56
was in LA at the time. There you go. 500 square foot apartment. So I know your life. And we could not go outside.

Rachel White 31:03
But I had so where we lived, we had a private balcony and a private roof deck because we were on the top floor. And you got that with our unit and you paid for it. But we were busy. We never used it. And then I had a meditation center in Oak Park, like, right to the west, where we lived in the west loop that had a private roof deck. And I said to my husband, you know, I gotta get outside. I’m gonna freak, I’m gonna freak out then. So let’s plant some flowers. Let’s do something. And it literally just came like that attached to nothing else. So we did that. And then because I’m kind of an asshole, and I can’t just have a hobbyist, like, we should make flower essences. You know, there’s things that I buy and that we take and, and so he’s a chef, and we’re like on Google, you know, making our being busy. Did it and then I was like, you know, I wonder what it would look like if I put like a totem label, literally just pure sort of play. I kind of gave them out as gifts to my friends. They loved them. And then my husband was like, You need to make these and sell them. And so I started doing it. And then I had a client a really good friend of mine, Claire shout out to Claire was like you gotta get on Etsy. I was like, I don’t know, Etsy, isn’t it like macro? She’s like, No, no, no, no. And she’s an artist, and he’s doing tremendous work on there. And so I did, and it’s a huge part of my business now. And then I studied herbalism and I got certified herbalism. And then you learn all kinds of other stuff. And I’m telling you, that was just all allowing, I didn’t sit down and go my body, my my body of work, my business needs another product. And here’s why. And I ran the numbers and I have an Excel spreadsheet about there was none of that in and it’s turned a profit the first month. And I didn’t know that. I had no idea. And but you know, it’s intuition matched with by the way work. You should see the house there are 10s of 1000s of bottles. My friends who stayed with me were like, are you okay? mentally? And they’re like, No, people make these with yours. Like, now I listen to a lot of podcasts. Yeah, just hand bottle out and they were like, holy shit.

Lesley Logan 33:06
Yeah, I love that you brought up that like, you kind of just you put like almost like one foot in front the other like, yeah, I got outside.

Rachel White 33:14
I like wow, I liked learning.

Lesley Logan 33:16
Yeah. And you you didn’t try to control like what the flowers were going to represent before no landed them. And I think that that’s something very hard for I’m I call myself a recovering perfectionist overachiever. Because i not i don’t think i think recovered would mean I mean, perfect, perfect about it. But I think that the best things come from I’m just going to try this out. And yeah, too often either people in your life go well, what are you how you make money off that that’ll never make any money? Or you do this? What about your kids? What about this? And it’s like, you have to turn their dial off and just kind of like go okay, who am I I may have to protect my hobby or protect my curiosities for a little bit to be mine. Because we, yes, everything does cost money and everything. We do need to make more money in this world than we ever had to make to be part of it. But you’re not allowing when you try to micromanage what it is before it starts.

Rachel White 34:13
And don’t listen to the well meaning morons. When I started totos

Lesley Logan 34:18
Rachel, I hope you have a shirt like that.

Rachel White 34:21
I got you wouldn’t believe how mean people who were who I know liked me and were supportive of me were because they thought it was a disaster. Right? And I had a friend I asked her if she wanted to design the logo, because I didn’t end up going with her for obvious reasons. You’ll hear in a second. She was like, you know, this is crazy. And you’re never going to be successful. You’re never gonna be able to do it. And literally, I’m not making that up. It was that like, specific and intense. And then I did it and then she was like, oh, and I was like, right. You know, if they couldn’t do it, maybe they don’t see it because they’re not connected to that they’re not supposed to be manifesting that stuff here. They have their own thing to do. and just giving yourself permission to do and by the way, in corporate in tech, the mantra of innovation is fail small, fail early fail often. It’s not never fail. It’s not get a crystal ball out and control your entire future. It’s the understanding that through doing things, you will learn experientially, and that you’ll be able to incorporate that and hone things. Or even if you test hypothesis, and it’s faulty. You’ve learned something that’s a successful experiment. Right? Yes, you and just converting it, whatever you learn into something of value. And the other thing I would say, though, is when you work like this, you do have to work. Yeah, there’s no playing around and then not putting an elbow grease, you know? Yeah.

Lesley Logan 35:43
Yeah, it’s true. I mean, that’s the that’s the hardest part. I think a lot of people will look at other people, they’ll look at you or they’ll look at me and go, Oh, must be so easy. Or they just like,

Rachel White 35:53
because I have I’ve never worked harder and I’ve never had a worst boss. And it’s me.

Lesley Logan 35:59
I do think I’m kinder than my worst worst bosses, but I can’t part of myself. But it’s so funny because I we have flashcards which I like, are like tarot cards for Pilates exercises, really. That’s how I mean, as a classical teacher, they have an order. But I also tell people, like just pick up cards pull card out. And if you can’t do that exercise, like turn it around and see what other exercises involved in there. And one of the hardest things was not creating the actual card. And I’m sure even for you with I don’t know, I don’t wanna put words in my mouth. But like for the taro part, is like actually getting the production of the cards like trying to get somebody in 2020 to print the cards, the way I wanted, with the quality materials I wanted, and to ship them to people.

Rachel White 36:41
Yeah, I know. And someone gave me a really hard time I got invited to this book event and the lady. She’s brilliant. She’s a, like a writing coach, publishing coach helps people get on TED talks, stuff like that. She’s very successful. And she’s like, Rachel, I was on the day for self publishing, because that’s what we did. And so my guess is when you publish on Amazon, they’re evil. I’m like, hey, it was in the middle of COVID. I’m my only employee it was with my money. Are you kidding me? Right now? You’re that’s the thing you’re gonna pick you with? Yeah, it was a miracle that we got it done. Yeah. Yeah. And they’re not the publisher. I’m the publisher. It’s just on their platform.

Lesley Logan 37:21
Well, and, and also, guess what, guys, I also am on Amazon, you want to know why? Because people will trust Amazon? Over my website.

Rachel White 37:25
Yeah, it’s easy for them. And I knew I was going to be moving to Texas, I couldn’t physically manage the inventory. Like there are pragmatic concerns. And you know, it’s that whole, like, there’s always something someone out there is going to be on and they, if nothing else, I will ask everyone to start if you can kindly educate people on what it’s like to have a small business or to be running a p&l in another larger business there. I think sometimes people to your point, they really lack compassion for you, in a lot of ways.

Lesley Logan 38:03
Yeah. Yeah. And I, I, it’s so it’s, it’s so tricky, because you want to like pick and choose your battles, but also like, yeah, you know, we have, I think we need to get to a point where we stop judging people for the tools that they’re using to get their message out there. Because unfortunately, like, when you’re a small business, there are so many expenses that you don’t even think about, when you get started, there are money for the newsletter you’re sending money for. So it’s really, you know, sometimes you have to and then you, you can, once you get things up and you get to test it, you get to see like, what is the feedback? Was this a good idea? What’s this, then you can actually like, take it to another place. You know, it’s so important that we just have a little bit more compassion for small businesses and also understand like, there are also avenues out there that just allow us to get our message out there faster. And sometimes we have to use it, especially when you’re small.

Rachel White 38:59
I mean, I wasn’t going to Epstein’s Island all the time I got on the flight logs. I just published something on COVID. And so yeah, nuances is important, too. Yeah.

Lesley Logan 39:11
Okay, Rachel, I want to ask, like, what are you excited about right now? Like, what is something that you’re really excited to be working on?

Rachel White 39:18
Oh, well, the the big, big thing I have to say is the podcast. And, you know, this was another thing I did just because I wanted to have discussions with people and share them. Because so much of what I do for a living is I talked to really interesting people in a really intimate, meaningful way. Like there’s no small talk in a client session. With totem, and that’s not just me, that’s people come they want to talk about their life’s purpose or, you know, they they’re just very honest and vulnerable. And so, it occurred to me like I know a lot of interesting people, and I want people to hear this. Yeah. And so I’ve been doing interviews for season two, and it’s been really fun and I am clients do it because I’m like, You’re interesting. They’re like, No, I’m not. I’m really, I’m like, that’s enough of this. Everybody’s interesting, right then working on that. And it’s funny because I don’t have a producer, my best friend Roger does the audio editing and I sent him like a couple 100 bucks, every episode or something, I don’t even keep track of it. And people go like, well, you must be like, making so much money. I was like, Oh, my God, no, that’s not how podcasts work. And they’re like, don’t you have sponsors? And like, do you want to be sponsored? Be a sponsor, I’d love to talk to you about that. But it’s the joy of just doing the thing and seeing that you had an idea. I’m sure you had this feeling too. And then it’s actually out there. It’s actually happening. People listen to it. It’s so exciting. Yeah, it feels so good. So I’m really focused on that. We’re going to make another deck actually a flower medicine deck, because of all the flower essences and herbalism. I just, it’s the time projects like that you really need block of time.

Lesley Logan 40:56
And yeah, we can we can talk offline about like the time I set up, because I have the decks that I did, there’s six months total. And I really thought I could knock out to a year. And we are we’re at one year, folks. And the reality is, is not because I can’t make the time. I’m not even like these are not even spiritual things. These are like things I already have a lot of the content made, I just have to repurpose it. But it is it’s been in that brain space and focusing and it takes now between all the man hours, when we when I stopped counting the man hours, it’s usually around four or 500 man hours, like between human hours of like my time, and editors time, all this stuff. And so it’s just being able to set everything else aside, which means this podcast has to be recorded in advanced so that I don’t have to do podcasting. And my, my filming for my other thing, I’d have to be on that one. That’s my one project at the moment. And so it does they take time, but I so I hear you, we have some systems in place that make it easier for me. And even then it shaved off like I don’t know, 100 hours, which is not nothing but the (inaudible).

Rachel White 42:01
Well, the other thing is while you’re in pure creation on a project like that, unless you have a book deal, which I’ve been averse to, because of the degree of control. Yeah, I gotta have an Aquarius moon, I don’t like being told what to do I have a vision I’m a little tyrannical about creativity is I’m going to I don’t get paid during that time. And I have to pay to print it and publish it. And so you, you know, you can create all you want, but not you can’t do that. And then expect everything else to strike along. I always say to people, when you say yes to everything without realizing you’re also saying no to things you’re not even thinking about. Yes, there’s it’s not infinite. You have to prioritize, right? Yes, yeah. So I use all of November in December for this kind of work. I don’t do any coaching work. I limit client sessions, and I slow down as the world gets darker and quieter. And I just do stuff like that every year.

Lesley Logan 42:58
I’m excited for your next deck. Take your time.

Rachel White 43:01
Thank you. I want it to be nice. We want to make it nice.

Lesley Logan 43:05
Yeah. And yeah. And also, you know, especially with things like that, they’re there. You can’t control the creativity either. So like, you also don’t want to force it or rush it or put it on some sort of timeline.

Rachel White 43:19
Every cards vision board and setup, I did that in two days, and I’m not on Adderall. This is all natural. This is just crazy.

Lesley Logan 43:29
When you’re in the flow, it’s through. You don’t need Adderall. Alright, we’re gonna take a brief break, we’re gonna find out where people can find you. Follow you work with you, and get your cards. Thank you.

Rachel White 43:39
Yeah, so you can find me at totem, reach on Instagram. Be prepared to be disappointed. I’m passive aggressive about social media. And totem Just send me an email. All my info is on the website.

Lesley Logan 43:53
Awesome. And that’s where you get your cards or everything is on to it.

Rachel White 43:58
It’s on Amazon. It’s the totem tarot deck. And then the skeptical shaman is Apple, Spotify, Google anywhere you listen to podcasts and season two starts the first week in October here. Perfect.

Lesley Logan 44:08
We will link all of that in our show notes. So make sure it’s everywhere. I’m already intrigued by your higher deck of cards. We’ll be heading Amazon up next. Before I let you go, you’ve given us like so much awesome advice. I feel like there’s been some great gems in there. But I always like to ask you Well, this bold, executable intrinsic or target advice people can take to be it till they see it. What do you have for us?

Rachel White 44:30
My big one that I’m doing right now because I also need help is I am taking a very strict digital detox one day a week from everything television, phone, computer screen. And for me, what that does is I get I get very clear on what matters. It lowers that cortisol. It lowers the fear and just the I’m very addicted to busyness and noise like I could listen to 18 podcasts a day. You know what I mean? I love consuming noise and Creating noise in my own way. And so I’ve been doing that and what happens on those days is miraculous, you’ll have the big business idea. So you don’t have to grind. It’s like a, it’s a retreat to move forward. And you know, if you have goals or anything else, just taking that time, it seems counterintuitive, but you get there faster. You really do. A lot of us when we’re working, working, working, you’re not thinking as deeply as you think you are. You’re just not You’re not seeing certain things. It’s actually a business imperative. I’ve decided I have to do that for my business.

Lesley Logan 45:35
Yeah, I love that. Oh, digital detox. I love it. I have been putting my phone on grayscale at night. And I don’t take it off grayscale until I like start making it like after breakfast because then it’s like, because what happens is inevitably, you open up an app and you start working. And I am like you I could just, I love what I do. I could just keep doing it. But it’s like I really, I my best days I noticed are because the grayscale comes off later in the day. So as soon as comes off, and it’s those beautiful colors. And you can see what app that is you start going there. So I I really like it and a whole day Lou, I’m gonna see how I can do I’m gonna challenge myself at the time this episode (inaudible).

Rachel White 46:17
Intermittent fasting, it really is, it’s a great way to reset. And I have better ideas. When I’m not just doing what I’m not in tactical execution. And I don’t have the discipline to not tactically execute. Yeah, unless it’s all shut off, so.

Lesley Logan 46:33
One more thing on this when I travel internationally, like I used to, I would never pay the phone company to let me use my phone internationally. Like there’s Wi-Fi if I need it, I’ll get Wi Fi like it’s, you know, where am I going? And a recent trip to Poland, I was annoying my husband and come with me. Another trick is helplessness they’ll because they’ll say he’ll be the one that gets to work. And so I’m like, Of course I can be safe because like he’s, he’s good. Yes. But I realized that because my phone worked in between being at a hotel or the Conference Center. I was struggling to be as present as I could just walking down these beautiful streets I hadn’t been in and I was like, oh, it’s because my phone works. And I can get a text message and I can get this and I’m like, Okay, we’re just going to go on airplane mode. Yeah, intentionally so that we can like be present. So I thank you for sharing that. Thank you for all of this. I am so excited about what you’re doing. You’re everything. I wanted to be in the tarot shaman world. Like it’s so fun to be like, Oh, I can have some crystals and do logic. Thank you so much, Rachel. Thank you, everyone. How are you going to use these tips in your life? When are you going to go on a digital detox and also what were your favorite parts about this make sure you tag Rachel tag Viet pods we can share it and until next time, be it till you see it. 

Lesley Logan
That’s all I’ve got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate this show and leave a review. And, follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to podcasts. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over on IG at the @be_it_pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us help others to BE IT TILL YOU SEE IT. Have an awesome day!

Lesley Logan
‘Be It Till You See It’ is a production of the ‘Bloom Podcast Network’.

Brad Crowell
It’s written, filmed and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan and me, Brad Crowell.

Lesley Logan
It is produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.

Brad Crowell
Our theme music is by Ali at APEX Production Music. And our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.

Lesley Logan
Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals and Ximena Velasquez for our transcriptions.

Brad Crowell
Also to Angelina Herico for adding all the content to our website. And finally to Meridith Crowell for keeping us all on point and on time.

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