The Importance of PR

in Staying Relevant

Ep. 272 with Lesley & Brad

“People actually just really like want to see who you really are and it’s way more fun that way.”

Lesley Logan

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Show Notes

Ever wondered about the magic behind authentic PR? Dive in with Lesley and Brad as they unravel Lesley’s insightful conversation with PR expert, Whitney Lee! Explore the world of genuine connections and discover the charm of organic engagement in this recap episode.

If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at [email protected]. Or leave a comment below!

And as always, if you’re enjoying the show please share it with someone who you think would enjoy it as well. It is your continued support that will help us continue to help others. Thank you so much! Never miss another show by subscribing at

In this episode you will learn about:

  • Learn to tailor PR strategies to align with your unique market.
  • Grasp the importance of valuing facts over emotions in PR narratives.
  • Discover PR’s crucial role in sustaining brand relevance.
  • Find out how to attract people who resonate with your vibe.

Episode References/Links:


Brad Crowell: Authenticity, right. And this idea of authentic, you know, I feel like it’s overplayed, but but the way that she talks about it, you know, it’s important to just be yourself, you have to be you and what it will happen organically is that you will attract people who appreciate your vibe, your personality, your nature, your you know, bubbliness or, you know, and vice versa, you’re actually going to be turning away people who just don’t vibe with you.


Lesley Logan
Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I’m Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I’ve trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it’s the antidote to fear. Each week, my guests will bring Bold, Executable, Intrinsic and Targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It’s a practice, not a perfect. Let’s get started.


Lesley Logan 0:20
Welcome back to the Be It Till You See It Interview Recap where my co-host in life Brad and I are going to dig into the pragmatic convo I have with Whitney Lee in our last episode. If you haven’t yet, listened to this episode yet, you should go back and do that. Because Whitney Lee is a badass. She also just won some awards in Florida where she’s like, of the women to know and the girl can dress I’m just gonna say it. So we love Whitney. Before we get into the interview, today is October 5, which is two days after Brad and I celebrate our wedding anniversary of eight years.

Brad Crowell 0:50
What? Holy cow.

Lesley Logan 0:51
I could be wrong on the (inaudible). I’m pretty sure I’m dead fucking right.

Brad Crowell 0:55
Yeah, you’re right.

Lesley Logan 0:56
Anyways, we used to wonder if it was October 3 or October 5 was our anniversary. We’re pretty clear it’s on the third.

Brad Crowell 1:02
Yeah, it was on the fourth. Yeah.

Lesley Logan 1:05
We really hope it was on the third.

Brad Crowell 1:06
It was the third it was the third.

Lesley Logan 1:08
It’s in our calendar guys don’t worry (inaudible). And today is the only two days after our eight year wedding anniversary. It is World Teachers’ Day and also World Meningitis Day. And because I thought both these are so important for you to know about first of all celebrate the teachers in your life and many of you are listening to this podcast so I celebrate all of you. (Brad: Yeah) And by the way, if your parents did not freak the fuck out of you about kissing someone wrong in college and getting spinal meningitis today’s the day someone tells you don’t kiss the wrong person. You could die.

Brad Crowell 1:45
I’ve never heard of this. She said it to me, I was like what are you talking about? (Lesley: I was warned) I thought you’ve got, I thought you got like what was the what was the sickness that you got (Lesley: Mono) I thought you got Mono from kissing people in college.

Lesley Logan 1:56
I got Mono before I’d ever kissed someone and you would not believe how much I had to convince my parents. I did not kiss anybody to get mono because all the fucking old wives tales had them convinced I must admit that was someone at any rate, I don’t believe in injuries to just come from kissing a frog. I do believe it does come from like college shit dorm room so watch yourself. And if you’re not in college, wash your hands. Okay, (Brad: Wash your hands) Everyone should just wash their hands.

Brad Crowell 2:21
Yeah, college is a pandemic is what she’s basically saying.

Lesley Logan 2:23
Well life is I mean it’s got a lot of shit going on. But at any rate, washing your hands is never a bad thing. (Brad: It’s never a bad thing.) Unless the water is (inaudible). Okay, so we are currently in Cambodia (Brad: Believe it or not.). So this is recorded ahead of time obviously. We are in Cambodia. Our retreat starts in a couple of days we are so excited. (Brad: Oh man.) eality is is that if you’re wanting to come to the next retreat, we’re only doing one next year (Brad: Only doing one.) So here’s the deal we’re gonna open up the doors for the early bird special to

Brad Crowell 2:54
Open up the doors. I’m just your hyped man today.

Lesley Logan 2:56
Okay, only those on the wait list. Oh my god, it’s a really bad (inaudible). (Brad: Oh, wow.) Seriously though, if you’re on the waitlist, you’ll get the early bird special. So you want to be on the waitlist will get you there. We will be opening the doors in January for you to sign up. The space is limited because the reality is we only have so many rooms in our house and so many rooms in our neighbor’s house. (Brad: It’s true.) It’s not their house. It’s like It’s like actual bed and breakfast. But at any rate, and there’s only so many seats on

Brad Crowell 3:30
We call it the guest house there. We don’t call it a bed and breakfast. (Lesley: They got a guest house.) Yeah, there’s a guest house.

Lesley Logan 3:36
So yeah. (Brad: November )Yeah. So then November when I get back when we get back from Cambodia. We have Nashville for our own personal stuff. No, I’m not teaching. I love you Nashville. We’ll talk. Then I’m going to head to Chicago to meet up with Erika Quest. The very first weekend of November. We’re teaching at the Club Pilates on St. Charles. And if you are wanting tickets to that, as of the recording of this episode, we actually do not have the public link for you yet. So you want to just DM me to see if there’s any spots left. And then it’s Thanksgiving. So you know, thanks you’re giving. And then we’re going to be in December on our winter tour. Now the winter tour is super fun. Actually the first weekend of December I’m actually going to Frisco for our annual Frisco workshops with Erika Quest, shout out to my baby again. And then I come back and then we load the van up and then we we actually hit our winter tour up which Texas you’ll be back in the limelight on the winter tour. So I expect to see you two times no excuses. And if you want more information on the winter tour, actually, Brad can tell you where to go.

Brad Crowell 4:47
Yeah, so you’re gonna go to

Lesley Logan 4:51
And lastly, all of these things are awesome but clearly sound like in person events. It’s not always possible. You might live somewhere amazing the world if you are a Pilates teacher, Happy World Teacher Today, and also, I may have spots left in my mentorship program. I only offer it once a year Sue, if you are wanting to basically get some confidence in how you’re teaching, make it easier to show up, teach and enjoy that time outside of teaching and really progress your clients and also your amazing practice, then you’ll want to go to to hear more about my mentorship. It’s pretty awesome. In fact, some people would call it a game changer, those people would be eLevate people.

Brad Crowell 5:31
Yeah. You can also send her a DM.

Lesley Logan 5:34
You can. You can send me a DM, it’s probably will probably will keep you from ending up on a waitlist and making sure that you actually get the information before it kicks off. Because once it kicks off, that’s it, folks. (Brad: That’s it, folks.) So, 2025, which is kind of nuts. So probably (Brad: That’s weird.) and also, we cannot guarantee what I’m doing in 2025. (Brad: That’s true.) I’m an Aquarius, you guys. That’s just how it goes. Anyways, before we talk about Whitney Lee, Brad, we have audience questions?

Brad Crowell 6:03
We do. Right now, we just are wrapping up Agency Mini from Profitable Pilates and (Lesley: It’s very wrapped.) Yeah. Well, yes, at the time of recording, Alexis George asks tips from keeping, what are tips to keep your clients moving and not talking as much?

Lesley Logan 6:23
Oh my gosh, raise your hand unless you’re driving only raise one hand. If your clients teach you treat you like they’re a therapist?

Brad Crowell 6:31
Oh, I mean, I think it just comes with the job, right?

Lesley Logan 6:35
Well, here is the deal. My loves. And it’s not like I didn’t have clients who did this. And it’s not like I didn’t see some of my favorite teachers who I love and respect have clients who do this, clients do this. However, it is out of your scope to actually therapize them. So you can listen to (Brad: Is that a word, therapize?) Yes, dear, look it up. It’s a word. If I were playing Scrabble, it’s a word. And it’s got a Z so I would like all the points.

Brad Crowell 6:57
It’s totally a word. Subject (Lesley: You heard it here.) to psychological therapy. (Lesley: Yeah.) You don’t need to therapize or fix each other.

Lesley Logan 7:05
Yeah, you don’t, unless you’re actually a therapist and actually paying you for that. But what I find is like movement, is where trauma leaves the body. And so there is going to be some discussion of things they are not going to be silent. You know, unless they’re a silent person, and there are those people, you’re just like, do you like this? Do you like me? Is this working? And the truth is that their workout faces and their workout, like being is not actually a true barometer of how amazing your teaching is. Nor is their talking too much, but what you can do. First of all, I love exercises that make them have to focus. So you can actually go hey, I want to hear the story.

Brad Crowell 7:48
So did you say coordination? I’m pretty sure that you said coordination.

Lesley Logan 7:50
Yeah. How’s that going? For you, Brad?

Brad Crowell 7:51
Yeah, it’s going. (Lesley: Yeah, you’re doing it.) I didn’t do it right. I did it wrong. 100%.

Lesley Logan 7:57
Okay. Thank God for flashcards anyway, so you pick an exercise that makes them have to think so first of all, I let my client absolutely tell me everything about their day, their neighbors, that, you know, the weekend lives in their building, and all that shit, during footwork. Because guess what, when the 100 comes, they have to shut the fuck up. They have to this is where you all, even if your contemporary teacher, can I just say steal the footwork through the 100, it will help because the footwork, they can talk, talk talk, it’s fine. You’re just looking at seeing what their body’s doing anyways, and then 100 they cannot breathe in for five and out for five and pumped arms at the same time, and tell you about their day, unless they’re fucking amazing. And therefore that story must be worth hearing. So I love to make a joke like, oh, wow, you really want to tell me the story while you’re counting to 100. I’m impressed. And it kind of gets them to go, Oh, I am so sick in 200. Because I always say and if you’ve been to any class, on my tours, I say, I have never counted to 100 ever my 15-year career, and today is not the day I’m doing that. So these things are really helpful. Just bring people back to it. But also, again, because they’re moving trauma is going to leave the body. It may. They don’t know what that trauma is. And so they’re often just like talking because they don’t know what they’re feeling. And so it’s a little weird. And some people are verbal processors. Hello, I’m one of them. So I actually talk to Jay, on a zoom class with six other people there. I’m like, it’s too quiet. Let me tell you a story. All right. So I hear you. Here’s another tip. Don’t ask an actual question back. Just say, Oh, wow, that must have been really difficult, period. You know, so if you don’t ask a question back, or when you speak, you just bring them back to the exercise. And if they asked you a question, full permission, just go. Well, you know, I haven’t thought about that. Let me think about it and get back to you. Like you can actually just go let me think about that and get back to you. (Brad: Shut it down.) You don’t have to, and if they ask anything you should go, Look, this is really important that I progress you and you get your goals. Unless you just really love hanging out with me and paying for that. I really want to make sure you get your goals. Yeah. And that really helps because the thing is that they don’t reach their goals. If they ever have a bad day and their packages do, and they’re having bad money trouble. You’re on the chopping block. So it’s really important to bring it back to it and it’s difficult. You have to train them how to treat you, but it is possible. And again, make them work. They can’t speak at the same time. Okay, I love it. If you have questions, send them in.

Brad Crowell 10:34
Send in a DM.

Lesley Logan 10:35

Brad Crowell 10:39
All right, let’s talk about Whitney Lee. Whitney Lee is the founder of True Story. And she’s a seasoned PR expert who champions authentic connections. She simplifies complex strategies, empowering business owners to navigate challenges with an effective approach.

Lesley Logan 10:55
Okay, well, I’m gonna jump in. (Brad: Do it.) I loved some stuff. First of all, of course, I love this stuff. She said, she was giving advice about understanding your audience. And whether you are listening to this as a business owner, or listen to this as a person who is trying to like, get donation money for your nonprofit, or, I don’t know, get your family to understand that you don’t want to go to their house for Thanksgiving, just saying.

Lesley Logan 11:20
It’s extremely important that you understand the audience you’re trying to serve, trying to get to understand that you are the right thing for them that your way is better than the highway. Like, it’s really, really important to understand them and their goals and their needs. And so she said, be very clear on who you serve. For example, if you’re serving moms between 30 and 45, use that information. And especially now moms, moms today at 30 to 45 have often had two young kids. So like, if this was the 80s, my grandmother would be in this age group.

Lesley Logan 11:56
But today, they’re often like, they worked really hard. They made their money and they have having kids later. So what do these moms need? These are moms who used to have a whole life before they had kids, they actually had time to themselves. They actually, and I just watched a reel where this mom told her kids to like, draw picture of her sleeping, and then she took a nap while they’re trying, like these moms have, they know what it’s like to have been young and partying. And then also now not to be that so like, get information. And then if you can’t find the information you’re looking for, you should ask them because customers and consumers don’t think the way that business owners think they’re not thinking in the marketing and PR terms. So if so you can’t you can’t think like yourself, you have to think like them. And so sometimes just ask them, Why are you here? How did you find us? Why do you keep coming back? What is this doing for you? Like, I know that sounds weird, but it’s really fun. And I often would ask my clients this, especially when they would refer me people that I’m like, How the fuck? Did this person come in my doors? So I’m like, Oh, tell me more about what you told your friend about what we do here. And then I heard like, oh, like calm and it’s super relaxing. I love the coffee. And you just like you just like really helped me like think about what’s going on my day. And I’m like, none of those things are things I’m proud of, like none of those things so cool. Okay. Noted. Noted. We got to shut you up. But anyways, like, it’s so important. I’m joking. And also being truthful. Like.

Brad Crowell 13:27
well, you can empower your clients with the thing to say, right you can we talk about this a lot with our with our, you know, the clients that we coach, to just explain, hey, here’s what it is that we’re doing here.

Lesley Logan 13:39
Yes. And that is why you should ask people what it is you’re doing there because that will let you know if you’re doing a good job of that or not. And also it’ll let you know, like, where did they fight? Find out your information? Like, what what was their real reason for coming in. So that’s why I understand what their goals are. And even if not everyone has fitness goals, but like, Okay, but what prompted you to like actually spend the time to come here today? Like why now? What is it now? Right? So really kind of get in their head? Because that’s the best way for you to meet other people like them.

Brad Crowell 14:10
Yeah, yeah. And to get to know, you know who your actual person is.

Lesley Logan 14:14
Yeah. And it’s not a cartoon character. This is a real person. As we know from Hillary Hartling. It’s a real person. So ask real people.

Brad Crowell 14:21
Call back, Hillary Hartling. (Lesley: Episode…) No, good luck. I don’t know.

Lesley Logan 14:28
It was December of when we launched so I’m going to say 47, 49.

Brad Crowell 14:37
Close. 57.

Lesley Logan 14:38
What. (Brad: Yeah) Look at me. (Brad:) If someone’s listening for the first time, was like, I don’t understand that’s so far off. Let me just tell you I’m pretty darn close within 10 episodes most of the time. Kareen was a fluke.

Brad Crowell 14:54
All right. All right. All right. (Lesley: What did you love?) So I really enjoyed what she was talking about operating solely on emotions versus looking at, you know, the numbers, or looking at facts is what she was talking about actually, she said, it’s not about how it feels or how you feel about it. Because we often operate in that space where we’re operating based off the way we feel. Right? And she said, what ends up happening is that we end up because of the way we feel we end up seeking evidence to support that feeling. Right, which can be a downward spiral, or you can be completely kidding yourself.

Lesley Logan 15:33
Oh, yeah. We talked about this with the doctor Philippe. Philippe

Brad Crowell 15:39
Douyon. Yes.

Lesley Logan 15:40
I’m not gonna be able to recall the episode we had him on twice. So there’s two different numbers in my brain, but he taught there’s an actual brain scientific thing for this, like cognitive, something something.

Brad Crowell 15:50
But, but so, you know, we ended up trying to prove or disprove things based on how we feel, and not on what’s happening around us what’s actually happening around us. And I thought that was really interesting. You know, she she actually said something really which I thought was, she said, you have to know, when you’re going down that path, and you need something. You need to be able to do something to kind of snap out of it.

Lesley Logan 16:17
Cold water. Ice plunge. (Brad: Sure.) Hot, cold shower. (Brad: Cold shower.)

Brad Crowell 16:23
Yeah. But I mean, she didn’t mention those things. But those are options. She said when she’s working with our clients, they definitely do not come up with strategies based off of feelings or hunches. Instead, they’re looking at hard truths. And they’re trying to find a way forward by looking at that, you know, what’s happening around them.

Lesley Logan 16:44
I think that’s true. I mean, I think it’s also important to acknowledge the feelings you’re having and share them with people so that you can also beware of a pattern like, what, what sets off the feeling that you’re having? That is opposite of what the actual facts are. So that when you are having those feelings, you can go oh, oh, hold on. This is that time, like, you got to? (Brad: Yeah) we do that around the house, when we talked about this with Chris Goodman, like, I’ll, you’ll just be here with me walking out on my, I’m having a fear of success, right now. I’m gonna go take a shower, like, I’m gonna go like, pause this out. But I wouldn’t be able to do that today, where I like to live like go, Oh, these feelings are going to keep me from actually paying attention to what is actually happening. They’re going to derail me, they’re gonna make me make up products that are not for real things. So so I’m aware of that now, I wasn’t aware of that before. And it took me longer to figure it out. So I actually think it’s really important to acknowledge them so that you can pay attention to the hard truth, you can go seeking it out when they come up. My opinion. (Brad: Well said.)

Brad Crowell 17:53
All right. So finally, let’s talk about those be it action items, what bold, executable, intrinsic or targeted action items, can we take away from your convo with Whitney Lee? She said, The most important thing you can do for all of y’all out there because obviously she runs a PR firm, right? So she has a bunch of clients. And the whole one thing I thought was interesting, actually, I’m just gonna throw this in here. Before the bold truth is she talked about the difference. The distinction between PR and sales. She said sales is very obviously, you’re trying to generate money coming in. PR, you’re trying to stay at the top of the conversation. You’re trying to stay relevant. (Lesley: Yes.) And so I suppose the first time I ever heard, like that distinction.

Lesley Logan 18:33
Also like you’re creating authority, like the perception of authority, yeah.

Brad Crowell 18:38
Totally. But part of that staying relevant is using social media. And she said, the most important thing, if you’re just getting started, is to reject this idea of what people think you are and that they, that you you try to, like put out content for what you think they need, and instead, do you think they think so. Right? And is that you should be putting out content based on you being you. Right? Authenticity, right? And this idea of authentic, you know, I feel like it’s overplayed, but but the way that she talks about it, you know, it’s important to just be yourself, you have to be you and what it will happen organically is that you will attract people who appreciate your vibe, your personality, your nature, your you know, bubbliness or, you know, and vice versa, you’re actually going to be turning away people who just don’t vibe with you in that way. And that’s actually okay. Right. So she said, it has to you have to stop being overly manicured with photos and get into stories daily. And actually just be yourself in your stories. And then she said, figure out how you’re different and talk about that on social media.

Lesley Logan 19:53
Yeah. So many great reminders actually did a story of me I’m in my pajamas right now. You guys we’re recording this in my pajamas. I put them on for 30 today. And then I was like, Oh, I haven’t done a video in this outfit for Tabby yet. And so I was like, alright, so I did a little story. I’m like, I’m like, so I filmed two workouts, and I didn’t need to change the sweaty clothes. So I put on my pajamas for 30, more like 60 to get that for the rest of the day. And I did it and they’re like, Oh, we love this. You should be in pajamas all day and they shared it and I’m like, You know what? That is actually so much more fun. It really really is. It’s so much easier it’s so you know, we get on our heads like oh my god, what is this background look like the house, whatever. But it’s like people actually just really like want to see who you really are. And it’s way more fun that way. So I really love her advice there. I loved and her Be It action items to continually put yourself out there. She said it is really important to pursue opportunities too often people are waiting for the opportunities to come their way pursue them so not pitches. Gaius is in a pitch right now for earn media coverage, partnerships, speaking engagements, podcast tours, like just wherever you’re wanting to be seen based on who you want to serve. So remember podcasts. If you’re if your peeps are over a certain age, God bless them. They’re still not here yet. We’re working on it. Gaia is sending out a pitch, she’s,

Brad Crowell 21:16
She’s at a certain age,

Lesley Logan 21:17
She is a lady of a certain age, she’s

Brad Crowell 21:19
Now barking at nothing.

Lesley Logan 21:21
Yes, she barked at a bolster today you guys should. At any rate, that is the bead accent, which I really, really love. We’re just going to talk over Gaia because it’s okay. She also said to offer value. And this is really, really important. So when you reach out to a podcast or by the way, if you’re if you’re listening to this and you’re about to pitch to me, please do not tell me how amazing you are, you have to tell me how amazing what you have to share on my podcast is for my listeners. And so whenever I pitch to be on podcasts, and very specifically one like, Hey, I heard your podcast is about this, here’s what I could talk about to support your listeners and your mission. So be there make sure you’re very clear on like, how you actually benefit the people that you’re pitching to. Because they get pitched up all day long. Of course you want them to talk about you, but they’ve earned that audience. So you have to make sure that you actually are supporting that that connection they have with the audience. And then she said

Lesley Logan 22:16
the best angle, focus on giving. Educate and give without asking for anything in return it will come back to you. You know, we had Rory Vaden on last month and he is very big on this. He in fact, like he talked about how he just gave so much advice to Lisa and so many bill you that they don’t have him Tom, thank you guys, that they were like we have to pay you like we actually pay you for this. So like, you have to just like focus on the service and it all comes back. That’s how the world works. All right. I’m Lesley Logan.

Brad Crowell 22:48
And I’m Brad Crowell.

Lesley Logan 22:48
Thank you so much for listening to me, Brad, Gaia. And of course this podcast we’re so grateful for you. Truly, really I can’t believe we’re about to hit the 300th episode. (Brad: I know it’s kind of insane.) It’s insane. Clare Solly was like do you realize I just listened to Episode 250 that means you’re gonna be at 300 really quickly and I’m like oh shit, yes we are. Do we need, we will figure how to use this soundboard over here before then. Anyways, we are so grateful to you for sharing this podcast to someone you know who needs to hear it. And until next time. Be It Till You See It.

Brad Crowell 23:18
Bye for now.

Lesley Logan
That’s all I’ve got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate this show and leave a review. And, follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to podcasts. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over on IG at the @be_it_pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us help others to BE IT TILL YOU SEE IT. Have an awesome day!

Lesley Logan
‘Be It Till You See It’ is a production of ‘Bloom Podcast Network’.

Brad Crowell
It’s written, filmed and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan and me, Brad Crowell.

Lesley Logan
It is produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.

Brad Crowell
Our theme music is by Ali at APEX Production Music. And our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.

Lesley Logan
Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals and Ximena Velasquez for our transcriptions.

Brad Crowell
Also to Angelina Herico for adding all the content to our website. And finally to Meridith Crowell for keeping us all on point and on time.

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